Houston rap master Bun B is widely respected as one of hip-hop's most influential architects, both from his two decades as one half of UGK as well as his extensive solo work and formidable features catalog. He's also a pillar of the music community, serving as vice president on the Recording Academy Texas Chapter, where he's activating his leadership role to drive meaningful conversations about racism. Recently, he participated in a webinar called "Industry Mix: Amplifying Black Voices" to open up the dialogue with his colleagues, which will be available soon here on GRAMMY.com.

The day after the webinar, GRAMMY.com caught up with the GRAMMY-nominated artists specifically to hear his thoughts on the climate of racial injustice in America, what the music industry and non-Black allies can do to support change and the many ways he's fighting for the cause.

[Editor's Note: This interview was conducted prior to Bun B learning that his son had tested positive for COVID-19.]

How did the "Industry Mix: Amplifying Black Voices" webinar yesterday go for you?

It went really good. We always want to make sure that we in Texas are doing our part. We have a very diverse chapter, but it doesn't hurt to have these kinds of conversations. We're trying to lead my example, in terms of the Texas Chapter. I'm vice president now, and our president's Latino, so the president and I are just trying to make sure that our chapter is engaging in these conversations right now and making sure that whatever level of action we can take collectively, as well as individually that we're going towards that.

So we came up with the idea of having a panel conversation within the chapter for people to ask questions. A lot of people have been asking different questions, everyone doesn't have the same frame of reference and perspective for these issues. So we just want to make sure that people know in this chapter if there's anything that they're curious about or need more information about that we create a platform to get them that information.

How would you describe the current situation? How does it look from your perspective?

It's progressively getting better, day by day, but we're still a very far ways off from getting to where we really feel we need to be. We have more people who are not people of color standing up and saying that Black Lives Matter, which is a bit refreshing, because racism has long been a fight surely by people of color in this country. So there's always a certain contingency of people who are not of color that engaged, but we've never had the numbers that we have now.

I said yesterday, we're very encouraged by people being willing to step up and stand up right now, so that's the encouraging. But we still have a lot of ground to cover. Racism in America and in the world for that matter is not going to go away quickly or easily, and they're counting on us to give up and kind of fall to the wayside with it.

So there's a certain level of urgency that we have to constantly stay reminded of, because unfortunately these different acts that are happening every day, so we're consistently reminded of the state of the country. Don't get me wrong today looks better than yesterday, but we still got to fight for tomorrow.

What does change look like to you?

Change looks like equality. Change looks like racial equality, where every human being, no matter what race they represent, what religion they represent, is treated as an equal citizen in this world. Equality as far as economic- there is racism that exists in America, that one, doesn't allow Black people to enter certain type of corporations to be involved with certain types of businesses in this country. Even the people that are allowed to work for certain companies don't get to move up to executive positions. There are a lot of fortune 500 company that do not have Black people or people of color in executive board positions. Even when Black people want to own businesses, there's always issues were being allowed to lease or rent or even purchase commercial real estate in America. So that hinders a lot of opportunities for Black people to, to work towards economic equality, so that's been an issue.

And then judicially equality in terms of how Black people are arrested, the kinds of charges Black people face all the time, the way Black people are prosecuted and sentenced in this country. A Black person stands in front of a judge for the same crime as a white man and get stiffer penalties. And so, we have a lot of different things that we want to fight for. Even the way that we're the way that we are arrested, the way that we're taken into custody, sometimes they don't even make it to the precinct in America. So there's a lot of different things on different levels that we got to fight for. So we're, we're getting racism from all angles right now, at every level.

How do you feel the music community and the music industry can do more?

Well, I think the first step of action for artists is to use their platform in a way that helps to benefit. So some artists can use their platform to put together a calls-of-action, to spread information, help to organize people, rally people together, other artists are creating music that galvanizes people, music that informs people, and just educate people about what's certain people in this country and in the world are going through. Some, some artists are more financially stable than others, especially with the industry is being slowed down based off of COVID-19, so a lot of them are funding initiatives. They're covering bail costs for people when peaceful protesters get arrested. So there's many different ways that artists can engage and have been engaged. Whatever it is that you feel in your heart, even if you can't protests. Everybody can't always attend the rallies, especially with the virus going on right now, but there are many different ways that artists can and have been activating and engaging in the space right now.

Well, and I think you have led by example, maybe you could talk a little bit about some of the things you've done to activate and advocate.

What we did yesterday with the panel discussion was to make sure that we're having these conversations, that we're talking about what Black people are going through, how Black people are feeling and what they see on a daily basis. With our Chapter as well as with the Academy, we're trying to make sure we talk about racism and police brutality, and we want to make sure that people who don't necessarily have the same perspective on these issues that we have, make sure that they're informed and educated on what people of color go through in this country.

It's not what you see on television. It's a lot more, just on a daily basis, even though police are killing us on the streets of America, there is voter suppression right now to suppress the Black vote and vote for people of color in America. But there's a lot of everyday harassment that Black people deal with, not being allowed in certain businesses, levels of provocation that people try to push us to so that we can try to fit their angry Black person stereotype, you know, that kind of stuff.

We organized a rally and a March for peace with a peaceful protest here in the city of Houston we drove above 70,000 people through the streets of Houston. We try to make sure that, even though we have a good relationship with our chief of police and the mayor of Houston here, that we still hold them accountable for transparency when it comes to the police department and different executive orders and initiatives that our city hall and our city council can push forward and to help shift the dynamic when it comes to interactions with people of color and the police in their communities. So, we do have great relationships with the leaders of this city, but we don't know rest on that at the same time… you could have a good relationship with the chief of police and still hold the chief of police accountable. Those two thing aren't mutually exclusive, right? So we can do both, and so we make sure that we do both.

Tomorrow we're going to Frankfort, Kentucky, which is the state capital of Kentucky, to demand that the police officers that killed the Breonna Taylor in Louisville, Kentucky be arrested and charged with murder. So far only one police officer has been reprimanded, but he still hasn't been charged and arrested and taken into custody. We went to Minneapolis to stand with Stephen Jackson when he was demanding justice for the four police officers that murdered George Floyd. We're doing what we can on a local level and we're supporting people on a national level as well. Anywhere we feel like we have a voice and we can help with what's going on, just bring attention to the situation and be active on the front lines, that's what we're going to do.

I think you've already addressed this question, but in your opinion, what should non-Black people be doing to support the Black community right now?

Well, they should definitely have that tough conversation with their friends, have these conversations with family. make sure that in their house that they're not tolerating racism, and that they're not doing anything to the hinder the process. If they have Black friends, they should ask their Black friends to talk to them about what life is like for them, educate themselves on what Black people and people of color deal with on a daily basis. I think that's very important. I think they should support initiatives that they see in their city and nationwide either by action or financially. We're not talking about thousands of dollars, $20, $30 for the good cause. Every little bit helps. And if you're indifferent and you don't feel like you need to do it, then recognize that you're part of the problem, and that [racism] will never go away unless you do your part. That's the most important thing.

How are you practicing self-care and coping during this time?

Well, I'm all in for this fight, right? So, I, even though I have, I'm not numb by the images I see on television, I'm taking good care of myself. I have a very strong family. My wife is very supportive of everything I do. My wife will normally march and stand with me. It's just, COVID is a lot right now, even though she didn't participate in the march and the rally in Houston, she doesn't feel safe traveling with me when I go to these different cities.

And just talking about it, being aware that a lot of this imagery can be triggers for certain people, and can bring back a lot of trauma people have, seeing people being slammed up against the cars and on the street by police is unfortunately many people of color have seen before. So a lot of this stuff can be a trigger. But I just pray very deeply. And I made sure to try to take some time to calm down, unwind, listen to easy music and try to decompress with whatever spare time I have available. Yeah, I just find a quiet space to have some quiet time to myself.

Thank you for sharing that. Are you working on anything creative during this time, or have any upcoming projects?

I was already working on several projects. I was finishing an album that I was doing with Manny Fresh. I was finishing another album and I was doing it with the producers, Zaytoven and during our actual quarantine, I recorded a full album with an artist from Houston by way of Louisiana. His name is LE$. We basically went out to a 400-acre farm in West Texas, kind of separated ourselves from everybody. It's the largest residential recording complex in the world, in West Texas. And so we went out there and kind of talked about what it's like being isolated and just trying to find peaceful moments to yourself. It's a very calming, very relaxed album, which is a little different from some of the more aggressive stuff that I've done. Like right now, I literally just left from Trae Tha Truth's house because he's put together a song with different artists talking about the state for America right now.

I'm trying to stay as productive as possible right now. I feel like this is a great time for creatives to be creating, so I definitely encourage other artists to take the time if they can, if they have a recording set up at home, to definitely talk about how they feel, what's on their mind, because I'm almost certain the majority of people in America kind of feel the same way they feel right now, both with the repercussions of the Coronavirus in America as well, that constant influx of imagery dealing with racism and police brutality.

For sure. Is there anything else that you want to say at the moment?

I'm very happy that the Recording Academy understands the need for having these kind of conversations and understands that we, as creatives, whether we're songwriters, musicians, singers, rappers, whatever it may be, we have power, right? There is power and strength in our words and in our message and in our unity right now. So I'm glad that Harvey Mason jr. and the rest of the Academy is not only supporting us, but standing with us and making their own respective statements and I want the Academy to be a part of things that we all want to see in this world.

Want To Support Protesters And Black Lives Matter Groups? Here’s How

Updated Friday Oct. 13, 2023 to include info about Kendrick Lamar's most recent GRAMMY wins, as of the 2023 GRAMMYs.

A GRAMMY veteran these days, Kendrick Lamar has won 17 GRAMMYs and has received 47 GRAMMY nominations overall. A sizable chunk of his trophies came from the 58th annual GRAMMY Awards in 2016, when he walked away with five — including his first-ever win in the Best Rap Album category.

This installment of GRAMMY Rewind turns back the clock to 2016, revisiting Lamar's acceptance speech upon winning Best Rap Album for To Pimp A Butterfly. Though Lamar was alone on stage, he made it clear that he wouldn't be at the top of his game without the help of a broad support system. 

"First off, all glory to God, that's for sure," he said, kicking off a speech that went on to thank his parents, who he described as his "those who gave me the responsibility of knowing, of accepting the good with the bad."

Looking for more GRAMMYs news? The 2024 GRAMMY nominations are here!

He also extended his love and gratitude to his fiancée, Whitney Alford, and shouted out his Top Dawg Entertainment labelmates. Lamar specifically praised Top Dawg's CEO, Anthony Tiffith, for finding and developing raw talent that might not otherwise get the chance to pursue their musical dreams.

"We'd never forget that: Taking these kids out of the projects, out of Compton, and putting them right here on this stage, to be the best that they can be," Lamar — a Compton native himself — continued, leading into an impassioned conclusion spotlighting some of the cornerstone rap albums that came before To Pimp a Butterfly.

"Hip-hop. Ice Cube. This is for hip-hop," he said. "This is for Snoop Dogg, Doggystyle. This is for Illmatic, this is for Nas. We will live forever. Believe that."

To Pimp a Butterfly singles "Alright" and "These Walls" earned Lamar three more GRAMMYs that night, the former winning Best Rap Performance and Best Rap Song and the latter taking Best Rap/Sung Collaboration (the song features Bilal, Anna Wise and Thundercat). He also won Best Music Video for the remix of Taylor Swift's "Bad Blood." 

Lamar has since won Best Rap Album two more times, taking home the golden gramophone in 2018 for his blockbuster LP DAMN., and in 2023 for his bold fifth album, Mr. Morale & the Big Steppers.

Watch Lamar's full acceptance speech above, and check back at GRAMMY.com every Friday for more GRAMMY Rewind episodes. 

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This article was updated Sunday, Dec. 10, to add the full performer lineup.

The Recording Academy, Jesse Collins Entertainment and CBS have announced “A GRAMMY Salute to 50 Years of Hip-Hop,” a once-in-a-lifetime live concert special celebrating the 50th anniversary of hip-hop. Airing Sunday, Dec. 10, at at 8:30 p.m. ET/8 p.m. PT on the CBS Television Network and streaming live and on demand on Paramount+, the two-hour tribute special will feature exclusive performances from hip-hop legends and GRAMMY-winning artists including Black Thought, Bun B, Common, De La Soul, Jermaine Dupri, J.J. Fad, Talib Kweli, The Lady Of Rage, LL COOL J, MC Sha-Rock, Monie Love, The Pharcyde, Queen Latifah, Questlove, Rakim, Remy Ma, Uncle Luke, and Yo-Yo. Newly announced performers include rap icons and next-gen hip-hop superstars 2 Chainz, T.I., Gunna, Too $hort, Latto, E-40, Big Daddy Kane, GloRilla, Juvenile, Three 6 Mafia, Cypress Hill, Jeezy, DJ Quik, MC Lyte, Roxanne Shanté, Warren G, YG, Digable Planets, Arrested Development, Spinderella, Black Sheep, and Luniz. See the full performer lineup.

Read More: 50 Artists Who Changed Rap: Jay-Z, The Notorious B.I.G., Dr. Dre, Nicki Minaj, Kendrick Lamar, Eminem & More

The “A GRAMMY Salute To 50 Years Of Hip-Hop” live concert will take place on Wednesday, Nov. 8, at YouTube Theater at Hollywood Park in Inglewood, California. The concert will then air on Sunday, Dec. 10, at 8:30 p.m. ET/8 p.m. PT, as a live concert TV special celebrating the profound history and monumental cultural impact that hip-hop has made around the world.

The “A GRAMMY Salute To 50 Years Of Hip-Hop” live concert is open to the public. Tickets are on sale now.

Full concert details are below:

Concert:
Wednesday, Nov. 8, 2023 (tonight)
Doors: 6 p.m. PT
Concert: 7 p.m. PT          

Venue:
YouTube Theater
1011 Stadium Dr.
Inglewood, CA 90305

Full List Of Confirmed Performers For "A GRAMMY Salute To 50 Years Of Hip-Hop": 

2 Chainz

Akon

Arrested Development

Battlecat

Big Daddy Kane

Black Sheep

Black Thought

Blaqbonez

Boosie Badazz

Bun B

Chance The Rapper

Coi LeRay

Common

Cypress Hill

D-Nice

De La Soul

Digable Planets

DJ Diamond Kuts

DJ Greg Street

DJ Jazzy Jeff and the Fresh Prince

DJ Quik

DJ Trauma

Doug E. Fresh

E-40

GloRilla

Gunna

J.J. Fad

Jeezy

Jermaine Dupri

Kool DJ Red Alert

The Lady of Rage

Latto

LL Cool J

Luniz

MC Lyte

MC Sha-Rock

Monie Love

Mustard

Nelly

The Pharcyde

Public Enemy

Queen Latifah

Questlove

Rakim

Remy Ma

Rick Ross

Roddy Ricch

Roxanne Shanté

Spinderella

Styles P

T.I.

Talib Kweli

Three 6 Mafia

Too $hort

Tyga

Uncle Luke

Warren G

YG

Yo-Yo

^Names in bold indicate newly added artists.

Purchase tickets here.

Stay tuned to GRAMMY.com for more news and updates about "A GRAMMY Salute to 50 Years of Hip-Hop."

A GRAMMY Salute to 50 Years of Hip-Hop is produced by Jesse Collins Entertainment. Jesse Collins, Shawn Gee, Dionne Harmon, Claudine Joseph, LL COOL J, Fatima Robinson, Jeannae Rouzan-Clay, and Ahmir "Questlove" Thompson for Two One Five Entertainment serve as executive producers and Marcelo Gama as director of the special.

Hip-Hop Just Rang In 50 Years As A Genre. What Will Its Next 50 Years Look Like?

It's rare that a genre can be traced back to a single artist or group, but for funk, that was James Brown. The Godfather of Soul coined the phrase and style of playing known as "on the one," where the first downbeat is emphasized, instead of the typical second and fourth beats in pop, soul and other styles. As David Cheal eloquently explains, playing on the one "left space for phrases and riffs, often syncopated around the beat, creating an intricate, interlocking grid which could go on and on." You know a funky bassline when you hear it; its fat chords beg your body to get up and groove.

Brown's 1965 classic, "Papa's Got a Brand New Bag," became one of the first funk hits, and has been endlessly sampled and covered over the years, along with his other groovy tracks. Of course, many other funk acts followed in the '60s, and the genre thrived in the '70s and '80s as the disco craze came and went, and the originators of hip-hop and house music created new music from funk and disco's strong, flexible bones built for dancing.

Legendary funk bassist Bootsy Collins learned the power of the one from playing in Brown's band, and brought it to George Clinton, who created P-funk, an expansive, Afrofuturistic, psychedelic exploration of funk with his various bands and projects, including Parliament-Funkadelic. Both Collins and Clinton remain active and funkin', and have offered their timeless grooves to collabs with younger artists, including Kali Uchis, Silk Sonic, and Omar Apollo; and Kendrick Lamar, Flying Lotus, and Thundercat, respectively.

In the 1980s, electro-funk was born when artists like Afrika Bambaataa, Man Parrish, and Egyptian Lover began making futuristic beats with the Roland TR-808 drum machine — often with robotic vocals distorted through a talk box. A key distinguishing factor of electro-funk is a de-emphasis on vocals, with more phrases than choruses and verses. The sound influenced contemporaneous hip-hop, funk and electronica, along with acts around the globe, while current acts like Chromeo, DJ Stingray, and even Egyptian Lover himself keep electro-funk alive and well.

Today, funk lives in many places, with its heavy bass and syncopated grooves finding way into many nooks and crannies of music. There's nu-disco and boogie funk, nodding back to disco bands with soaring vocals and dance floor-designed instrumentation. G-funk continues to influence Los Angeles hip-hop, with innovative artists like Dam-Funk and Channel Tres bringing the funk and G-funk, into electro territory. Funk and disco-centered '70s revival is definitely having a moment, with acts like Ghost Funk Orchestra and Parcels, while its sparkly sprinklings can be heard in pop from Dua Lipa, Doja Cat, and, in full "Soul Train" character, Silk Sonic. There are also acts making dreamy, atmospheric music with a solid dose of funk, such as Khruangbin’s global sonic collage.

There are many bands that play heavily with funk, creating lush grooves designed to get you moving. Read on for a taste of five current modern funk and nu-disco artists making band-led uptempo funk built for the dance floor. Be sure to press play on the Spotify playlist above, and check out GRAMMY.com's playlist on Apple Music, Amazon Music and Pandora.

Say She She

Aptly self-described as "discodelic soul," Brooklyn-based seven-piece Say She She make dreamy, operatic funk, led by singer-songwriters Nya Gazelle Brown, Piya Malik and Sabrina Mileo Cunningham. Their '70s girl group-inspired vocal harmonies echo, sooth and enchant as they cover poignant topics with feminist flair.

While they’ve been active in the New York scene for a few years, they’ve gained wider acclaim for the irresistible music they began releasing this year, including their debut album, Prism. Their 2022 debut single "Forget Me Not" is an ode to ground-breaking New York art collective Guerilla Girls, and "Norma" is their protest anthem in response to the news that Roe vs. Wade could be (and was) overturned. The band name is a nod to funk legend Nile Rodgers, from the "Le freak, c'est chi" exclamation in Chic's legendary tune "Le Freak."

Moniquea

Moniquea's unique voice oozes confidence, yet invites you in to dance with her to the super funky boogie rhythms. The Pasadena, California artist was raised on funk music; her mom was in a cover band that would play classics like Aretha Franklin’s "Get It Right" and Gladys Knight’s "Love Overboard." Moniquea released her first boogie funk track at 20 and, in 2011, met local producer XL Middelton — a bonafide purveyor of funk. She's been a star artist on his MoFunk Records ever since, and they've collabed on countless tracks, channeling West Coast energy with a heavy dose of G-funk, sunny lyrics and upbeat, roller disco-ready rhythms.

Her latest release is an upbeat nod to classic West Coast funk, produced by Middleton, and follows her February 2022 groovy, collab-filled album, On Repeat.

Shiro Schwarz

Shiro Schwarz is a Mexico City-based duo, consisting of Pammela Rojas and Rafael Marfil, who helped establish a modern funk scene in the richly creative Mexican metropolis. On "Electrify" — originally released in 2016 on Fat Beats Records and reissued in 2021 by MoFunk — Shiro Schwarz's vocals playfully contrast each other, floating over an insistent, upbeat bassline and an '80s throwback electro-funk rhythm with synth flourishes.

Their music manages to be both nostalgic and futuristic — and impossible to sit still to. 2021 single "Be Kind" is sweet, mellow and groovy, perfect chic lounge funk. Shiro Schwarz’s latest track, the joyfully nostalgic "Hey DJ," is a collab with funkstress Saucy Lady and U-Key.

L'Impératrice

L'Impératrice (the empress in French) are a six-piece Parisian group serving an infectiously joyful blend of French pop, nu-disco, funk and psychedelia. Flore Benguigui's vocals are light and dreamy, yet commanding of your attention, while lyrics have a feminist touch.

During their energetic live sets, L'Impératrice members Charles de Boisseguin and Hagni Gwon (keys), David Gaugué (bass), Achille Trocellier (guitar), and Tom Daveau (drums) deliver extended instrumental jam sessions to expand and connect their music. Gaugué emphasizes the thick funky bass, and Benguigui jumps around the stage while sounding like an angel. L’Impératrice’s latest album, 2021’s Tako Tsubo, is a sunny, playful French disco journey.

Franc Moody

Franc Moody's bio fittingly describes their music as "a soul funk and cosmic disco sound." The London outfit was birthed by friends Ned Franc and Jon Moody in the early 2010s, when they were living together and throwing parties in North London's warehouse scene. In 2017, the group grew to six members, including singer and multi-instrumentalist Amber-Simone.

Their music feels at home with other electro-pop bands like fellow Londoners Jungle and Aussie act Parcels. While much of it is upbeat and euphoric, Franc Moody also dips into the more chilled, dreamy realm, such as the vibey, sultry title track from their recently released Into the Ether.

The Rise Of Underground House: How Artists Like Fisher & Acraze Have Taken Tech House, Other Electronic Genres From Indie To EDC

Living Legends is a series that spotlights icons in music still going strong today. This week, GRAMMY.com spoke with Billy Idol about his latest EP,  Cage, and continuing to rock through decades of changing tastes.

Billy Idol is a true rock 'n' roll survivor who has persevered through cultural shifts and personal struggles. While some may think of Idol solely for "Rebel Yell" and "White Wedding," the singer's musical influences span genres and many of his tunes are less turbo-charged than his '80s hits would belie.  

Idol first made a splash in the latter half of the '70s with the British punk band Generation X. In the '80s, he went on to a solo career combining rock, pop, and punk into a distinct sound that transformed him and his musical partner, guitarist Steve Stevens, into icons. They have racked up multiple GRAMMY nominations, in addition to one gold, one double platinum, and four platinum albums thanks to hits like "Cradle Of Love," "Flesh For Fantasy," and "Eyes Without A Face." 

But, unlike many legacy artists, Idol is anything but a relic. Billy continues to produce vital Idol music by collaborating with producers and songwriters — including Miley Cyrus — who share his forward-thinking vision. He will play a five-show Vegas residency in November, and filmmaker Jonas Akerlund is working on a documentary about Idol’s life. 

His latest release is Cage, the second in a trilogy of annual four-song EPs. The title track is a classic Billy Idol banger expressing the desire to free himself from personal constraints and live a better life. Other tracks on Cage incorporate metallic riffing and funky R&B grooves. 

Idol continues to reckon with his demons — they both grappled with addiction during the '80s — and the singer is open about those struggles on the record and the page. (Idol's 2014 memoir Dancing With Myself, details a 1990 motorcycle accident that nearly claimed a leg, and how becoming a father steered him to reject hard drugs. "Bitter Taste," from his last EP, The Roadside, reflects on surviving the accident.)

Although Idol and Stevens split in the late '80s — the skilled guitarist fronted Steve Stevens & The Atomic Playboys, and collaborated with Michael Jackson, Rick Ocasek, Vince Neil, and Harold Faltermeyer (on the GRAMMY-winning "Top Gun Anthem") —  their common history and shared musical bond has been undeniable. The duo reunited in 2001 for an episode of "VH1 Storytellers" and have been back in the saddle for two decades. Their union remains one of the strongest collaborations in rock 'n roll history.

While there is recognizable personnel and a distinguishable sound throughout a lot of his work, Billy Idol has always pushed himself to try different things. Idol discusses his musical journey, his desire to constantly move forward, and the strong connection that he shares with Stevens. 

Steve has said that you like to mix up a variety of styles, yet everyone assumes you're the "Rebel Yell"/"White Wedding" guy. But if they really listen to your catalog, it's vastly different.

Yeah, that's right. With someone like Steve Stevens, and then back in the day Keith Forsey producing... [Before that] Generation X actually did move around inside punk rock. We didn't stay doing just the Ramones two-minute music. We actually did a seven-minute song. [Laughs]. We did always mix things up. 

Then when I got into my solo career, that was the fun of it. With someone like Steve, I knew what he could do. I could see whatever we needed to do, we could nail it. The world was my oyster musically. 

"Cage" is a classic-sounding Billy Idol rocker, then "Running From The Ghost" is almost metal, like what the Devil's Playground album was like back in the mid-2000s. "Miss Nobody" comes out of nowhere with this pop/R&B flavor. What inspired that?

We really hadn't done anything like that since something like "Flesh For Fantasy" [which] had a bit of an R&B thing about it. Back in the early days of Billy Idol, "Hot In The City" and "Mony Mony" had girls [singing] on the backgrounds. 

We always had a bit of R&B really, so it was actually fun to revisit that. We just hadn't done anything really quite like that for a long time. That was one of the reasons to work with someone like Sam Hollander [for the song "Rita Hayworth"] on The Roadside. We knew we could go [with him] into an R&B world, and he's a great songwriter and producer. That's the fun of music really, trying out these things and seeing if you can make them stick. 

I listen to new music by veteran artists and debate that with some people. I'm sure you have those fans that want their nostalgia, and then there are some people who will embrace the newer stuff. Do you find it’s a challenge to reach people with new songs?

Obviously, what we're looking for is, how do we somehow have one foot in the past and one foot into the future? We’ve got the best of all possible worlds because that has been the modus operandi of Billy Idol. 

You want to do things that are true to you, and you don't just want to try and do things that you're seeing there in the charts today. I think that we're achieving it with things like "Running From The Ghost" and "Cage" on this new EP. I think we’re managing to do both in a way. 

**Obviously, "Running From The Ghost" is about addiction, all the stuff that you went through, and in "Cage" you’re talking about  freeing yourself from a lot of personal shackles. Was there any one moment in your life that made you really thought I have to not let this weigh me down anymore?**

I mean, things like the motorcycle accident I had, that was a bit of a wake up call way back. It was 32 years ago. But there were things like that, years ago, that gradually made me think about what I was doing with my life. I didn't want to ruin it, really. I didn't want to throw it away, and it made [me] be less cavalier. 

I had to say to myself, about the drugs and stuff, that I've been there and I've done it. There’s no point in carrying on doing it. You couldn't get any higher. You didn't want to throw your life away casually, and I was close to doing that. It took me a bit of time, but then gradually I was able to get control of myself to a certain extent [with] drugs and everything. And I think Steve's done the same thing. We're on a similar path really, which has been great because we're in the same boat in terms of lyrics and stuff. 

So a lot of things like that were wake up calls. Even having grandchildren and just watching my daughter enlarging her family and everything; it just makes you really positive about things and want to show a positive side to how you're feeling, about where you're going. We've lived with the demons so long, we've found a way to live with them. We found a way to be at peace with our demons, in a way. Maybe not completely, but certainly to where we’re enjoying what we do and excited about it.

[When writing] "Running From The Ghost" it was easy to go, what was the ghost for us? At one point, we were very drug addicted in the '80s. And Steve in particular is super sober [now]. I mean, I still vape pot and stuff. I don’t know how he’s doing it, but it’s incredible. All I want to be able to do is have a couple of glasses of wine at a restaurant or something. I can do that now.

I think working with people that are super talented, you just feel confident. That is a big reason why you open up and express yourself more because you feel comfortable with what's around you.

Did you watch Danny Boyle's recent Sex Pistols mini-series?

I did, yes.

You had a couple of cameos; well, an actor who portrayed you did. How did you react to it? How accurate do you think it was in portraying that particular time period?

I love Jonesy’s book, I thought his book was incredible. It's probably one of the best bio books really. It was incredible and so open. I was looking forward to that a lot.

It was as if [the show] kind of stayed with Steve [Jones’ memoir] about halfway through, and then departed from it. [John] Lydon, for instance, was never someone I ever saw acting out; he's more like that today. I never saw him do something like jump up in the room and run around going crazy. The only time I saw him ever do that was when they signed the recording deal with Virgin in front of Buckingham Palace. Whereas Sid Vicious was always acting out; he was always doing something in a horrible way or shouting at someone. I don't remember John being like that. I remember him being much more introverted.

But then I watched interviews with some of the actors about coming to grips with the parts they were playing. And they were saying, we knew punk rock happened but just didn't know any of the details. So I thought well, there you go. If ["Pistol" is]  informing a lot of people who wouldn't know anything about punk rock, maybe that's what's good about it.

Maybe down the road John Lydon will get the chance to do John's version of the Pistols story. Maybe someone will go a lot deeper into it and it won't be so surface. But maybe you needed this just to get people back in the flow.

We had punk and metal over here in the States, but it feels like England it was legitimately more dangerous. British society was much more rigid.

It never went [as] mega in America. It went big in England. It exploded when the Pistols did that interview with [TV host Bill] Grundy, that lorry truck driver put his boot through his own TV, and all the national papers had "the filth and the fury" [headlines].

We went from being unknown to being known overnight. We waited a year, Generation X. We even told them [record labels] no for nine months to a year. Every record company wanted their own punk rock group. So it went really mega in England, and it affected the whole country – the style, the fashions, everything. I mean, the Ramones were massive in England. Devo had a No. 1 song [in England] with "Satisfaction" in '77. Actually, Devo was as big as or bigger than the Pistols.

You were ahead of the pop-punk thing that happened in the late '90s, and a lot of it became tongue-in-cheek by then. It didn't have the same sense of rebelliousness as the original movement. It was more pop.

It had become a style. There was a famous book in England called Revolt Into Style — and that's what had happened, a revolt that turned into style which then they were able to duplicate in their own way. Even recently, Billie Joe [Armstrong] did his own version of "Gimme Some Truth," the Lennon song we covered way back in 1977.

When we initially were making [punk] music, it hadn't become accepted yet. It was still dangerous and turned into a style that people were used to. We were still breaking barriers.

You have a band called Generation Sex with Steve Jones and Paul Cook. I assume you all have an easier time playing Pistols and Gen X songs together now and not worrying about getting spit on like back in the '70s?

Yeah, definitely. When I got to America I told the group I was putting it together, "No one spits at the audience."

We had five years of being spat on [in the UK], and it was revolting. And they spat at you if they liked you. If they didn't like it they smashed your gear up. One night, I remember I saw blood on my T-shirt, and I think Joe Strummer got meningitis when spit went in his mouth.

You had to go through a lot to become successful, it wasn't like you just kind of got up there and did a couple of gigs. I don't think some young rock bands really get that today.

With punk going so mega in England, we definitely got a leg up. We still had a lot of work to get where we got to, and rightly so because you find out that you need to do that. A lot of groups in the old days would be together three to five years before they ever made a record, and that time is really important. In a way, what was great about punk rock for me was it was very much a learning period. I really learned a lot [about] recording music and being in a group and even writing songs.

Then when I came to America, it was a flow, really. I also really started to know what I wanted Billy Idol to be. It took me a little bit, but I kind of knew what I wanted Billy Idol to be. And even that took a while to let it marinate.

You and Miley Cyrus have developed a good working relationship in the last several years. How do you think her fans have responded to you, and your fans have responded to her?

I think they're into it. It's more the record company that she had didn't really get "Night Crawling"— it was one of the best songs on Plastic Hearts, and I don't think they understood that. They wanted to go with Dua Lipa, they wanted to go with the modern, young acts, and I don't think they realized that that song was resonating with her fans. Which is a shame really because, with Andrew Watt producing, it's a hit song.

But at the same time, I enjoyed doing it. It came out really good and it's very Billy Idol. In fact, I think it’s more Billy Idol than Miley Cyrus. I think it shows you where Andrew Watt was. He was excited about doing a Billy Idol track. She's fun to work with. She’s a really great person and she works at her singing — I watched her rehearsing for the Super Bowl performance she gave. She rehearsed all Saturday morning, all Saturday afternoon, and Sunday morning and it was that afternoon. I have to admire her fortitude. She really cares.

I remember when you went on "Viva La Bam" back in 2005 and decided to give Bam Margera’s Lamborghini a new sunroof by taking a power saw to it. Did he own that car? Was that a rental?

I think it was his car.

Did he get over it later on?

He loved it. [Laughs] He’s got a wacky sense of humor. He’s fantastic, actually. I’m really sorry to see what he's been going through just lately. He's going through a lot, and I wish him the best. He's a fantastic person, and it's a shame that he's struggling so much with his addictions. I know what it's like. It's not easy.

Musically, what is the synergy like with you guys during the past 10 years, doing Kings and Queens of the Underground and this new stuff? What is your working relationship like now in this more sober, older, mature version of you two as opposed to what it was like back in the '80s?

In lots of ways it’s not so different because we always wrote the songs together, we always talked about what we're going to do together. It was just that we were getting high at the same time.We're just not getting [that way now] but we're doing all the same things.

We're still talking about things, still [planning] things:What are we going to do next? How are we going to find new people to work with? We want to find new producers. Let's be a little bit more timely about putting stuff out.That part of our relationship is the same, you know what I mean? That never got affected. We just happened to be overloading in the '80s.

The relationship’s… matured and it's carrying on being fruitful, and I think that's pretty amazing. Really, most people don't get to this place. Usually, they hate each other by now. [Laughs] We also give each other space. We're not stopping each other doing things outside of what we’re working on together. All of that enables us to carry on working together. I love and admire him. I respect him. He's been fantastic. I mean, just standing there on stage with him is always a treat. And he’s got an immensely great sense of humor. I think that's another reason why we can hang together after all this time because we've got the sense of humor to enable us to go forward.

There's a lot of fan reaction videos online, and I noticed a lot of younger women like "Rebel Yell" because, unlike a lot of other '80s alpha male rock tunes, you're talking about satisfying your lover.

It was about my girlfriend at the time, Perri Lister. It was about how great I thought she was, how much I was in love with her, and how great women are, how powerful they are.

It was a bit of a feminist anthem in a weird way. It was all about how relationships can free you and add a lot to your life. It was a cry of love, nothing to do with the Civil War or anything like that. Perri was a big part of my life, a big part of being Billy Idol. I wanted to write about it. I'm glad that's the effect.

Is there something you hope people get out of the songs you've been doing over the last 10 years? Do you find yourself putting out a message that keeps repeating?

Well, I suppose, if anything, is that you can come to terms with your life, you can keep a hold of it. You can work your dreams into reality in a way and, look, a million years later, still be enjoying it.

The only reason I'm singing about getting out of the cage is because I kicked out of the cage years ago. I joined Generation X when I said to my parents, "I'm leaving university, and I'm joining a punk rock group." And they didn't even know what a punk rock group was. Years ago, I’d write things for myself that put me on this path, so that maybe in 2022 I could sing something like "Cage" and be owning this territory and really having a good time. This is the life I wanted.

The original UK punk movement challenged societal norms. Despite all the craziness going on throughout the world, it seems like a lot of modern rock bands are afraid to do what you guys were doing. Do you think we'll see a shift in that?

Yeah.  Art usually reacts to things, so I would think eventually there will be a massive reaction to the pop music that’s taken over — the middle of the road music, and then this kind of right wing politics. There will be a massive reaction if there's not already one. I don’t know where it will come from exactly. You never know who's gonna do [it].

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