Tierra Whack

Tierra Whack

Photo: Rich Fury/Getty Images

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Tierra Whack Talks Creative Process, Netflix Recommendations And Checkers’ Fries

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Hot off her first GRAMMY nomination and the release of the boldly innovative 'Whack World,' the Philly-based artist dishes on her music and life
Dan Weiss
GRAMMYs
Feb 26, 2019 - 5:17 pm

If you were to ask a bored music fan to describe exactly what kind of artist they’d like to see emerge to shake up the status quo, chances are high that Tierra Whack would be nearly made-to-order. She sings, she raps, she jokes incessantly, she laments the loss of a friend and a pet, she sings an expletive-laden country tune. The 23-year-old Philadelphian had released less than 40 minutes of music under her own name when she was nominated for her first GRAMMY (for Best Music Video) last year. And perhaps it’s just as well that she sidestepped the genre categories in her first GRAMMY go-round. In fact, the nominated video was for “Mumbo Jumbo,” an infectious melody sung in pure mushmouth with no actual words. Imagine Pearl Jam’s “Yellow Ledbetter” recast as Soundcloud-era R&B — well, you can’t really, can you?

She followed it up with Whack World, a 15-minute audiovisual tour de force that gives Lemonade look standard-issue. Comprising 15 one-minute songs by a virtually unknown artist (with a bright and colorful video for each one that splits the difference between Hype Williams and Dr. Seuss), the unprecedented project topped Noisey’s best-of-2018 list and made both Pitchfork’s and Robert Christgau’s top tens. Most other publications found room for the one-of-a-kind release somewhere on their year-end as well. It’s safe to say that there’s no obvious predecessor to Ms. Whack in any genre, and she’s just getting started. We spoke to her via phone about her instantaneous success and her first experience attending the GRAMMY Awards ceremony.

Congratulations on your nomination! “Mumbo Jumbo” was the first video you’ve ever made, right?

Thank you so much. Put out to the public, yeah.

That’s amazing to be recognized right off the bat —

For the very first one, right? Yeah!

And then you unleashed Whack World, which is like almost nothing that came before it. Do you consider it to be an “album?”

Nah. Uhh… I don’t really like to give it a title. Just a collection of songs? A bunch of different ideas that I just put all into one pot.

What was the biggest challenge for you in putting it together?

It wasn’t really a challenge, actually! It was just fun, because I have so many different sounds and flows.

Is it harder to write one-minute songs or three-minute ones?

One-minute songs are easy as hell!

It wasn’t a pain to get everything down to that exact 60 seconds?

No, not at all. I just got used to the time, I would get a feeling almost, like, ‘it’s about to be over, time to wrap it up.’

Did everything make it on there or do you have a lot of one-minute outtakes lying around?

I have a bunch here, it was about a total of 60 songs.

You didn’t want to go for a full hour of very short tracks?

An hour’s just…too much for the first thing that people are gonna know me for.

Were there also videos you shot that you didn’t use?

Not for Whack World, no. I knew I had the 15 songs, so I shot 15 videos.

So the visuals were entirely figured out after the music was done? Or did you write any of the songs with the video in mind?

I can never finish a song without having a visual in mind. That’s the way I finish anything almost, I have to see it in my head. I’m a visual person. Because you’re creating a story, you have to bring it all together.

I was curious because you just dropped the song “Only Child,” and it’s your first big release with no visual attached. Was it important for you to make sure people focus on the words and music this time?

Yeah, definitely. Let me see if I could just grab their ears.

Was it weird to figure out how to do Whack World live?

It doesn’t even feel… it’s funny because my DJ Zach [Whack, or just Zach! when he performs solo] mentioned that, but it’s never weird. Sometimes we would do the songs twice.

Was there a conscious attempt to show off as many different sides of you as you could? “F*** Off” is one of my favorites and I’ve been curious about your relationship to country music.

I just surprise myself every day. Each day I record I’m always doing something different that I’ve never done. So I feel like I’m a new artist every time I go to the studio. And I have so much to offer so why make it all one thing? But I definitely hold Dolly Parton down. A lot has been going on for me and I’m always doing interviews, press, and everything, so stuff might not hit me at the moment but later, I remember it. I hear something and then it might stick at a random time.

Do you put your ideas down into an app?

Yeah, I’ll use Notes or my Voice Memo app a lot, or I’ll just text or call my manager like what do you think about my crazy idea. He’ll remember anything I bring up, even if it’s like a year from now.

What was the last idea you put down in your Notes app?

Ummm… [checking] Do I wanna give that up? Let me see… oh right, somebody already did it before, but growing up, one of my favorite movies was Bubble Boy, and I’ve always wanted to perform in a bubble.

Wayne Coyne from the Flaming Lips performs in a bubble. And I think he just got married in one, too!

That’s fire! That’s so fire.

So you’ll have to top that.

Yeah, it’s not like, original, but it’s something I just want to do and put my own twist on it.

For all the colorful visuals and playful language on Whack World, you display some real sadness on “Four Wings” and “Pet Cemetery.”

There’s sadness on almost every song.

Was that a conscious thing you wanted to contrast with all the bright and perky videos?

That’s just who I am, that’s how I am. I may seem all happy and la-la-la but I’ve been through some real s***, you know? I’m half and half. But I think everybody is that way.

You sing in many different voices on Whack World. Are there any you’d like to bring back and do more with?

There’s no telling.

What about remixing a one-minute song into a two-minute song?

Nah, I don’t like that at all. Why are we making a Men in Black 8? Why are we making Final Destination 30? It’s classic, leave it alone. I don’t want to see another Chucky. Some things you just have to leave it there. Let it be.

So there won’t be a Whack World II then?

Not that I know of.

You’ve gotten to spend quality time with André 3000, Lauryn Hill, Meek Mill… whose reaction to Whack World was your favorite?

I’ve never thought about that! It’s funny because these celebrities, we don’t actually talk about music, we just talk about regular, personal real-life stuff. When you just put those names up, I’m like ‘Wow, I can’t think of anything musical we talked about.’ But it’s like, if it’s something you do, like…my friend works at Checkers but she hates Checkers’ food. She’s been working there for like two years and she’s like, I hate it.

They have really good fries, though.

Exactly! I argue with her all the time, like, “Please bring me fries!” She’s like, “No, I hate it!”

And if you ask nicely, they’ll mix the banana shake with the chocolate shake.

That’s crazy, that sounds really good.



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So what was it like for you to attend the GRAMMYs for the first time?

It was really, really, really chill. I was eating pizza outside because they wouldn’t let me bring it in. It just felt like I went to a graduation or something.

How did you choose that colorful outfit that you wore to the event?

I went to a store in Philly and I saw the coat, I thought it was so fire. So I bought it, found the designer [Nancy Beringer], she’s from Philly and I thought that was cool, she DM’d me and we were talking and I said I was gonna wear that coat to the GRAMMYs so she said, “Oh, I’ll make you a dress to go with it!”

And where are you off to now?

Right now, I’m about to get up, go eat some Cheerios and probably listen to some beats or something. I was watching TV, this new show The Umbrella Academy is so good.

I just finished Russian Doll so maybe I’ll start that.

Wait, Russian Doll is good? I’ve seen the trailer but I was like… I’m not sure. I just got done The Umbrella Academy like an hour ago, but I hate when something is good and it only has one season. You get so addicted; I’m gonna store that in my files and wait ‘til the second season.

Meet The First-Time GRAMMY Nominee: H.E.R. On Being Born Into Music & Why R&B Is "At The Core Of Everything"

Hayden James

Hayden James

Photo: Cybele Malinowski

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Hayden James Dives Deep Into Debut Album, Feeling Inspired By Flume & Daft Punk

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"I wanted to keep it very true to what I do, which I think is very simple production but very powerful, very summery style beats as well," the Aussie singer/producer tells the Recording Academy about 'Between Us'
Ana Yglesias
GRAMMYs
Jun 19, 2019 - 11:01 am

Hayden James released his debut album, Between Us, on June 14. Featuring nine powerful vocalists across its 11 dreamy, chill-house tracks, it explores the different phases of romantic relationships in a story of like and love. But the Aussie singer/producer isn't the new kid in town. In fact, he's been putting out vibey, warm-weather jams for several summers now.

James first released his self-titled debut EP in 2013 on Aussie indie electronic label Future Classic, home to a small but mighty group of talent, including GRAMMY winner Flume. He followed with a trail of big singles, including "Something About You" in 2015, which put him on the map in both Australia and the U.S., with American dream-house duo ODESZA releasing a firery remix that same year.

Prior to dropping Between Us Stateside, we sat down with James to learn more about his vision for the project, what goes into choosing his collaborators, putting out an album versus a single, and how he gets the finished product to feel so fluid. James also talked about his biggest musical influences, which include his labelmates (Hi, Flume!), as well as the group that first caused him to fall in love with electronic music: GRAMMY winners and dance-music icons Daft Punk.

You're about to drop Between Us, your debut album. How are you feeling?

Great, amazing. It actually is out now in Australia. It hit midnight a couple of hours ago, tomorrow. I'm already getting some people commenting and going, "Oh, it's worth the wait." Because it's been six years since my first release and yeah, people have always just gone like, "We need more music," basically. So to be able to give them this, it feels incredible.

I don't think it's really hit me. It kind of did this morning; I've been up since 5:00 a.m. and through flying around a lot and the different time zones, but seeing it on Spotify for the first time and Apple Music, scrolling through I'm like, these aren't just demos on my phone anymore, people can actually actively listen to them now. It feels really cool.

What did you tweet earlier today, like, "I'm not crying, you're crying"?

Yeah. [Laughs.] I think I will later. Absolutely.

I bet it comes in waves, right?

Definitely. Yeah, for sure. And it's the first time I've ever had an album out, so, I'll let you know. [Laughs.]



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It’s finally here... my album, ‘Between Us’. I honestly didn’t think this day would come. It’s been a long journey to get here and I’m so proud of what I’ve created. ⁣ ⁣ Between Us is about those intimate moments in your life.. that energy you feel with someone. It’s a look at different stages of relationships - love, loss and everything in between. ⁣ ⁣ I dreamed of writing a record that you can press play on the first song and just let it play all the way through... no fillers - every song belonging, fitting into the story and meaning something special. I hope I’ve done this for you. ⁣ ⁣ To everyone that listens to my music, comes to my shows and supports me, thanks for waiting so long for this moment. I’m so excited to share this new music with you. ⁣ There’s so many people that helped me get here. To everyone involved in making this record with me, thank you from the bottom of my heart. You’ve helped me realise my dream. ⁣ This feels like just the beginning. ⁣ ⁣ Love, ⁣ Hayden James. ⁣

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I'm sure it's a different feeling from putting a track out that people really vibe with.

Yeah, one song and it's like, cool. But this is a whole story and it makes sense together so it's definitely... It's like I'm writing a book. And yeah, it nearly killed me. [Laughs.]

"I wanted to keep it very true to what I do, which I think is very simple production but very powerful, very summery style beats as well."

Going into that process of starting your first album, what was the main sound or goal you had with the project?

So the main goal was to not only tell this story of mine, but to keep the production the same. You know when a band or a group, they'll write a couple of singles or whatever, then they'll go for the album or they'll do the second album and there will be a change. It'll be like, "You know we're trying something different." I hate that. The reason I'm a fan of you is how you do something.

I wanted to keep it very true to what I do, which I think is very simple production but very powerful, very summery style beats as well. I've worked with a bunch of amazing feature vocalists on this, people who I've worked with previously too, so it kind of felt right to tell this story together.

I started the process about two years [ago]. I always wanted to write an album, but I actively said, "Hey, I want to do an album." That was about maybe two and a half years ago, actually. After I had written maybe 30, 40 demos, I kind of dwindled it down into 11.

What was that process like, of having to put your babies away in the corner?

I've still got them. But yeah it feels good to just choose the strongest ones, the ones that make sense together. I really enjoyed picking the order of the tracks as well, that's a huge thing for me. One of the big goals of mine as well with an album is, and you can't do this with many albums I don't think, is to listen, like press play on the first track and just listen through. There tends to be a lot of other filler songs or stuff that just doesn't make sense to the listener, which I'm sure that that'll be the case with this for a lot of it, but to me it makes a lot of sense. It was a lot of fun figuring out how they all fit together too.

Did having that "just press play and listen" qualifier help you find the sound of the album or the path of the songs?

Yeah, absolutely. These all fit together not just through the story, but also sonically as well. And they all kind of came effortlessly in that every single that I've ever done, it's been quite quick. It's often taken months to produce and make it what I want, but the actual writing of the song has always been literally a day or less with that vocalist, so that's what these songs represent too.

Where do you start when you work on a song? Is it the beat, is it an idea?

It's always different. I play piano and guitar and saxophone, so I'll just play and see what happens. I'll listen to friends' stuff and be like, "Oh, that's cool." I'll listen to older stuff as well, older electronic stuff. Or I'll have 10 or 15 demos, when I'm like, "Oh, I'm with Boy Matthews tomorrow, I'm gonna write a bunch of stuff quickly now." With literally just a couple of core progressions and maybe some different beat ideas, we'll get together and just start going and then it just evolves like that.

I was impressed by how you have nine different collaborators on the album and, even with those different inputs in the way they sound and their style, it all flows well so together.

Yeah, I think that's because I'm the one telling the story and they're helping me do that.

How did you choose the collaborators?

A lot of them through my label Future Classic. I met Shungudzo at the Future Classic x Dropbox studio [in Los Angeles] last year. I met Boy Matthews from a friend of a friend in New York the year before. Elderbrook, I toured with in the States, so there's all these different connections. Nat Dunn, who sings with NAATIONS on "Nowhere To Go" and on "Favours," she's an Aussie as well, but we had never met and have mutual friends. So yeah, it's all different connections. Some people I just reached out to on their Instagram and said, "Hey let's do something."

Were there any chance encounters, like someone introduced you to someone, but it felt naturally once it happened?

Yeah, the last song I wrote on the record is "Lost to You" featuring Farr, and the guy who sings on it is Romero. So I was in L.A. in January and kind of finishing up the album, but I felt like I needed a couple of more songs to choose from. And he is a friend of my manager actually, they manage him too but he hasn't really put a lot of stuff out yet. We had a session, I was literally flying out back to Sydney that night and I had like three hours, and we had a session near the airport, and within half an hour I was like, "This has got to be on the record." It just makes sense to me. Yeah so, that was very chance it was just like, "What?" And out here, the right time, the right place.

"Just Friends" with Boy Matthews was a really big summer track last year. Did you guys go back in the studio together to work on "Hold Me Back," or what was the process for the second collab together?

We didn't actually, because I haven't been here in the States for a little while, so we did that one just over the net and FaceTime. So I would rent out a studio here, like a Future Classic studio, or there's another one called Westlake Studios, and kinda just be on the phone with him, guiding him through what I was feeling and all that kind of stuff, and we would write together that way, just on FaceTime. And just send stuff back and forth. I think it wouldn't have worked if we didn't collaborate before and knowing how we work together. Everyone else I was in the studio with, but yeah the fact that we knew each other from before that and had collaborated very closely in the studio made it easier.

What was your hope going into that second song together? Were you trying to create your next summer hit?

Boy and I together equal pop music. So it's like the brother or sister of "Just Friends," a little bit darker. The theme revolves around the fact that you want to let this person go, but they're not leaving. So it's a bit darker and a bit sadder then "Just Friends," but I love it.

You talked a bit about being part of Future Classic, but I'd like to know a little more about what it's like being part of such a powerhouse indie label.

Yeah, it feels like a major label because of the incredible artists on it. It's amazing because they're an Aussie label and they've only just recently come over to the States.

The L.A. studio, I don't think it's a year old, but yeah they've been here in that office for maybe two years I think. They're Sydney guys and I knew of them because of Flume, Touch Sensitive and a whole bunch of people like that. So it's an honor to be a part of a group of such amazing artists that I look up to, and it's also great representing Australian music too, with an Australian label.

They're great people. They're so dedicated to what they do and they just got this idea of where they want to take things.

Do you feel like it enhances you as an artist creatively, being a part of that crew?

Yeah, definitely. I think because the music's so cool that people release, you feel... Not pressure, but just like, "I need to step up too and make my mark." 

Like healthy sibling rivalry with your brother or sister.

Exactly, it's like "Oh that's good! All right, sh*t." I just heard Flume's song with London Grammar and was like, that's tight, I always wanted to collaborate with someone like her. It's great too because we're all actually friends. I think all of us kinda live over here [in L.A.] now, but, we all live really close to each other in Sydney. It's pretty wild. What So Not, Flume, Touch, RÜFÜS DU SOL, Flight Facilities, we're all within like 20 miles of each other.

Do you have a good summer barbecues together? 

Absolutely, I had the ODESZA guys around last summer and they were like, "We need to move here, this is wild, you guys all live here together." And we've all got studios so we can all just hang out, and we send each other music all the time and demos.

That's cool, that sounds like being in a really good school for music.

Yeah, it's fully open, everyone trusts each other, it's good just to share other music as well, because we DJ as well, and just sharing what we're into.

What sort of music did you listen to growing up, and who are your biggest influences now?

Growing up, it was whatever my parents and my older brother would listen to. So my parents used to listen to Queen, David Bowie, Lionel Richie, the Beach Boys. I love the Beach Boys because of their harmonies and that's how I kind of got into music. My brother used to listen to Nirvana and Pearl Jam, Foo Fighters, but then he brought home Daft Punk's "Around The World." When I heard that it just changed my whole perspective on music, and I just started getting into dance music from there.

About how old where you then?

Sh*t, like, 15, 14. From there I was the biggest Daft Punk fan, even still now. There's a couple songs on my record, there's one called "Feelin'" which I'm singing on and it's got that very Daft funky vibe. And it comes from my love of my favorite album, [Daft Punk's 2001 LP] Discovery. That's [almost] 20 years old, Discovery. It's wild, I still listen to it, I'm like, if this was released now I'd still be in love with it.

It feels really classic without feeling super vintage.

Exactly. It's not so much the fact of they're telling story through their songs, but they're not relying on production of the time, which is what I try and do as well. If you can listen to a song that's five years old that you still love, that's great, it's a good song. I think for me it's important to be able to play a song on the guitar around a campfire, it doesn't have to be the electronic version of it. It's about writing songs first for me then producing at some point.

And you mentioned that the production part tends to be the longest part of the process for you. Are you kind of your own worst critic?

That's why it's taking me so long, yeah. Well, that's kind of the how of telling the story, we've got the why, with what the song is, and the how is that, well you can tell it any way you want, and that's the most difficult thing. I could've released this two years ago, but it just wouldn't have been anything like what it is now for me. So it's really important for me to be able to find that voice and get it right, through the production.

What do you think makes a good dance track? What about a good summer jam?

I mean, I love FISHER. I love just all that kind of massive builds into really simple drops. I don't write dance music really, but I love DJing so, yeah, lots of different dance music on my USB too, other than FISHER.

It's just all FISHER.

[Laughs.] It's all FISHER. But yeah totally different to writing songs, and summer songs.

For me it's like, there's a saying people say, "Don't bore us, get to the chorus." So it's just like, if there's a hook or something, I don't want eight bars of something before the first verse, it's like, let's go. I guess that's what pop music is for me as well, it's pretty immediate. And that's kind of what I figured out, when I wrote "Just Friends" and "Something About You" especially it's like, you are straight in, within the first five seconds, you're into the track you know what's going on immediately.

It takes a while to figure out, okay, why is this song so popular, what have they done? And a lot of people try and emulate that, unsuccessfully. And it's just about being unique but also figuring out, there are little things you can do, it's not a formula, it's a feeling. And the better you are at it the more you'll make it your own. So I feel like I've made a certain thing work for me.

It's kinda like your thesis statement as an artist, it can adapt and evolve but if you know, sort of the way you're going to go it makes more sense to the listener.

And it's got your DNA on it because you're writing it. And that's why there's a lot of other big pop stars out there that have people write their music for them, and you can kind of tell because it just doesn't feel right, it doesn't feel the same as what their earlier stuff felt like.

You have a big tour coming up: You're going to hit up Australia first, and then the U.S. in the fall. What are you most looking forward to about touring this time around?

Playing all the new music. When I was touring the last couple of years, it was off singles, and so what else do I play? Because when I played my live show I don't want to play anyone else's music, I like playing only stuff I've touched, so it's like remixes, edits of things. For years I've played demos of some of the songs that were on the album, I would just say "Hey, here's something new" and just see what the crowd reaction was. But now that I have an album that's probably the most exciting thing, I'm pumped about playing that live, but also bringing it to so many different cities in a new way as well. It's a new show, so I'm really excited about it.

When you would play demos and stuff did that sort of affect your creative process or editing process?

Definitely. I remember before "Better Together" was released with Running Touch I would structure it a bit differently live to make it build a bit longer and play some base notes on the SPD a little bit differently, and I'm like, "Actually, that's really hot, that's gotta be in the track." So yeah, playing something live changed a few things for me for sure.

Any hints you want to give to fans about the tour? What to expect, any special guests?

Yeah so I've got a couple of people. Especially on the West Coast I've got a whole bunch of people from the record. They're actually going to come and sing at the shows, which is cool. I love that, when I go and see a group and they've got the singers that actually perform on the track come out. So that's really fun. Brand-new production as well, the lighting thing that we've been working on with my Aussie guys for like six months.

What are you most excited about for next year?

I'm pumped for the album but I feel like there's a huge weight that's been lifted off me now. That's done and it's so exciting, and I feel way more confident.

I think that's one of the big things for me is, when you release something, there are people out there on the internet that will just shade you, and you're just like, "Aw, I feel horrible." Which is tough, and you've gotta learn just to say, "F*** off." Like, who are these people? So releasing the album, now I feel really confident because I'm so proud of it, no matter what anyone says or thinks about it, to be honest.

I'm just using that energy and writing a whole lot more. I'd love to do a couple of collaborations, first up. I want to release another two singles this year after the album. I've been speaking with the Gorgon City guys, the ODESZA guys. I have a whole bunch of stuff in the works already.

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Kool & the Gang

Kool & the Gang

Photo: Alison Buck/WireImage | Design: F Inomata/Recording Academy

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Kool & The Gang On 50 Years, The Joy Of "Celebration" & Songwriters Hall Of Fame

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"It's a blessing to be around for 50 years; some groups can't make it for 50 days. We did 50 years, that's an accomplishment," founding member Robert "Kool" Bell told the Recording Academy
Ana Yglesias
GRAMMYs
Jun 14, 2019 - 12:59 pm

2019 marks the 50th anniversary of GRAMMY winners Kool & the Gang, the group responsible for such everlasting, dance party-ready hits as "Celebration," "Ladies Night" and "Get Down On It."

They are also one of the most sampled artists of all time; the horns from their 1973 funky jam "Jungle Boogie" horns can be heard on over a hundred other songs, including rap classics like Luniz's "I Got 5 On It" and the Beastie Boys' "Hey Ladies."

"It's a blessing to be around for 50 years; some groups can't make it for 50 days. We did 50 years, that's an accomplishment," founding member Robert "Kool" Bell said.

"The gang was Kool, and we still cool, hopefully," group member Dennis Thomas added, laughing

Jun 14, 2019 – 12:51 pm

Kool & The Gang On Turning 50, "Celebration," More

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Earlier this month, the iconic funk/R&B group was honored with Philadelphia's prestigious Marian Anderson Award, joining the ranks of past recipients that include Quincy Jones, Berry Gordy, Oprah Winfrey and Maya Angelou. Last year, they were given the high honor of joining the Songwriters Hall Of Fame.

Before they took the stage at the GRAMMY Museum's Clive Davis Theater, the Recording Academy caught up with the Gang to learn more about the magic—and the masters—behind the hits. The special event, part of the Museum's star-studded programming, led to a lively conversation celebrating their 50 years that dove deep into the creation, genesis and legacy of the group.

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Alec Benjamin

Alec Benjamin

Photo: Recording Academy

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Alec Benjamin On Working With Alessia Cara, Meeting His Idol John Mayer & Chasing Dreams

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"People can't enjoy your art if you don't show it to them," Benjamin, who played more than 150 parking lot shows in 2016, told the Recording Academy in an exclusive interview
Ana Yglesias
GRAMMYs
Jun 13, 2019 - 4:22 pm

Phoenix-born, L.A.-based pop singer/songwriter Alec Benjamin calls himself the "narrator," going so far as to name his 2018 debut mixtape Narrated For You.

Over the last year, he's been actively growing his fan base and living his dreams. He's gone from playing more than 150 shows in parking lots outside of other pop artists' concerts in L.A. in 2016 to bringing out his idol, John Mayer, as a surprise guest during his headline show at the El Rey Theater this past May.

We caught up with the rising star to learn more about how he manifested Mayer into his life and how relocating from Arizona to California has shifted his musical career. We also found out what it was like working with recent collaborator (and GRAMMY winner) Alessia Cara, with whom he collaborated.

Jun 13, 2019 – 4:11 pm

Alec Benjamin Talks Pursuing Music Dreams

So you just performed at Bottle Rock in Napa. How was it?

It was awesome. It's the first time in a long I've performed at a festival and the first festival I've done in the U.S. When I first started making music I had the opportunity to do a couple of festivals abroad. But those are actually tented, so it felt like I was inside. This is the first festival I've played that was open air. I had a great time. I've never been to Napa before, it was beautiful.

I learned a lot from that experience because there's so many new things happening. The crowd was great and overall it was fun, but I was really nervous. It's just going to take some getting used to. I have a few more festivals that I'm going to be playing this summer. I'm happy that that was the first one that I did because the crowd was really welcoming and super friendly and also forgiving because I was really, really nervous.

Do you have any lessons from that experience going into Lollapalooza, and other summer festivals, that you're excited to showcase?

Yeah. I think I have a couple of changes that I want to make to the set. I'm excited about Lollapalooza. I'm excited about all of the festivals. And I'm excited about Lollapalooza because of the history that it has and there's so many people playing there. There's going to be a lot of artists that I'm going to get to see that I have never seen before, so that will be great. I'm just trying to go into with an open mind.

That's awesome, it is totally huge. Speaking of touring and live shows, you also wrapped part of your headline tour recently. What was your favorite city that surprised you on the tour?

There's one city that I hadn't spent a lot of time in before I started touring. Not even just for the show, the show was great, but I really like Seattle as a place. I thought it was beautiful and we got there on a really sunny day and we got to go down by the water and really try the food and hang out. People were really friendly.

And then I had a great time in Detroit. I thought Detroit was really, really cool. The crowd there was crazy. But I think overall every city was pretty awesome. I think that was probably the most surprising thing is that how great the crowds were everywhere that we went. Sometimes you don't get to spend as much time in the city exploring as you like. So that was a bit of a bummer, but ultimately I think all the shows were great. That was probably the most surprising thing. Not that I'm surprised the shows were good, but I didn't expect it, you don't expect every crowd to be so amazing and they were.

What do you think was one of the biggest challenges that you maybe didn't expect while touring?

Maybe the biggest challenge is getting adjusted to life on a tour bus. I was in a tour bus accident three years ago. That was a really short tour. This is the longest period I've lived on a tour bus, for almost seven weeks. I didn't realize how much that affected me. That was the first real near-death experience that I had. So getting back on a tour bus and have dreams about it and stuff, that was the hardest part. Just getting adjusted to living life on the road. That was difficult.

You often refer to yourself as a "narrator," and your album is called Narrated For You. Can you speak to how this idea guides the stories behind your music?

I wanted to define myself in that way just because, well, it made it easier in my music videos because then I didn't have to act in them. I could just tell the story. I'm really not great in front of the camera. I also think that sometimes it's nice to take words that you don't necessarily hear in the context of music and repurpose them. I mean, I'm a singer/songwriter, essentially, but that was the thought process behind it.

You released a new version of "Let Me Down Slowly," bringing on GRAMMY winner Alessia Cara, resulting in a great pop duet. How did that collaboration come about?

That came about because one of her fans sent me a message and was like, "She's doing promo right now and she was talking about your song!" So I tweeted her. I'm a huge fan of hers. I was like, "Yo, I love your music. We should work together." And she was down, like, "Oh, that would be great." Which was really exciting for me and I was surprised. We couldn't organize a time to write a new song together because we were both on tour. I was like, "Would you wanna do a verse on this song?" So she sent me a voice note of her verse. I was like, "That is amazing."

She has the best voice I've ever heard, ever. On a voice note with no editing. It's crazy. She sent it to me and I was like we should just put this on the song. It's super easy to work with her. She's just a good person.

That's so cool. Have you guys met in person yet?

Yeah. The first time we met was when we made the music video together. It was her and her friend that she travels with, and then I bought them both dinner. I was like, "This is the least I can do." The crazy thing is that we went to Downtown L.A. to get food. And we walked past the GRAMMY Museum, where they have all the people that have won GRAMMYs and one of them is for Best New Artist, which she had won [at the 60th GRAMMY Awards]. We took a picture next to her thing on the sidewalk, which was really cool.

Are there any other artists that you have your eye on working with?

I like it when it's a surprise who you collaborate with. When I thought about it after the collaboration had taken place [with Cara] I was like, oh, that makes sense. But I haven't really been thinking about it that much. I just want to improve my own music and then if the right collaboration comes along that would be great.

You've talked about how John Mayer is one of your biggest inspirations. Do you have any other musical inspirations who made you want to pursue music?

I really love Eminem. I love his storytelling. I'm a big fan of Paul Simon. I love Leonard Cohen. I like Citizen Cope a lot. I listen to a lot of different types of music, I also really like System of a Down. I listen to a lot of rock music and stuff. [Pauses.] Oh, I love Coldplay too.

Can you tell us a little bit about the backstory behind your song "Death of a Hero" and getting to perform it with John Mayer?

Yeah. It was really cool. I was just sitting in my van at that time, we were on tour. One of my friends was like, "Yo, wake up, man. You gotta check Instagram. John Mayer is posting about your music." It came out of nowhere. It was crazy. I had sent him a message in 2017 or 2016 just being like, "I love you. You don't understand. Thank you for everything." And then he saw it and responded to it. That was so cool. So he invited me over to his house to do "Current Mood," the show that he does on his Instagram. We just kept in touch since then and hung out. He came out at my show at the El Rey and performed with me; it was awesome.

You grew up in Phoenix and live in L.A. now. What was the moment that made you want to move out here? And what was the biggest shift you felt once you then were in L.A.?

I moved from Phoenix to L.A. because there's such a great creative community out here in California for songwriting, and there's a lot of labels and studios and things. When I decided to move my parents were like, "Well, if you want to go to California you have to go to college." So I went to school for a year and then I dropped out because I got a record deal. I was signed for two years and then I got dropped. So I moved back home, but luckily my parents had actually moved to California. Not because of me, it just worked out that way. My parents moved to California for work. So I moved back home and I started playing parking lot shows on the street in front of other artist's concerts to get fans. The last six months of 2016 I played 170 different shows. So I printed out tens of thousands of cards at Staples and handed them out anywhere I went.

It took a long time before I really felt a shift, like oh, this is the right decision. I think sometimes I often even now that I've been on tour and I'm not playing in parking lots anymore. Even though I still would. I'd do whatever I had to do. But even now sometimes I have doubts. I'm like, was this the right choice? But I think when I got to meet John Mayer, the person I looked up to and who he's the guy who inspired me to make music. So when he was like, "You done good," I was like okay, cool. That's dope. Because I was like, "I want to be you." And then he said, when I was doing his "Current Mood" Instagram show, "You're kind of like a version of me." I was like, "Dope." That's what I'm trying for. That moment I was like, okay cool. This was not a terrible decision.

I feel like that's part of being a human, no matter what we do.

Especially in this industry. It can be very fickle. You never know. I don't necessarily always feel like I'm on firm footing. This could all go away tomorrow. But that's the same with anything, you never know what's going to happen in life.

"People can't enjoy your art if you don't show it to them."

What's the biggest piece of advice you would give to someone at the start of their career?

One thing that I can say that was very hard for me to do, which I wish I would have understood sooner, is when you're writing songs and it kind of feels weird to show off your music. You don't want to be like, "Oh, check me out." You don't want to be that person, but at the same time, people can't enjoy your art if you don't show it to them. They're not just going to find it magically. It took me four years to get that. Even if it feels uncomfortable at first, show people your music. Post it, even if it's not perfect. Because it's never going to be perfect. Even the music I put out now, even my favorite songs that I put out I'm like, "They're not ready. Wait." I'm happy that I have people behind me being like "No, it's time."

Even if it takes you finding someone in your life to motivate you to just get your music out, just get it out there because even after it's out and it's solidified even if people like it or whatever, you're still going to be like, "Oh, but I could have... if I was only." It's never going to be perfect so you just have to go and show people and sing for people. If people at a party hand you a guitar, sing. You never know who's going to hear your stuff. Even if it's hard. Just do it.

GRiZ Talks Pride, Snoop Dogg Collab, Detroit's Music Scene, Giving Back & More

GRiZ

GRiZ

Photo: Jason Siegel

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GRiZ Talks Pride, Snoop Dogg Collab, Detroit's Music Scene, Giving Back & More

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"Be loud, be you, make some noise about it. And be of service to other people when they're in need," the DJ/producer said in a conversation with the Recording Academy
Ana Yglesias
GRAMMYs
Jun 12, 2019 - 2:17 pm

Funky-bass DJ/producer/saxophone player Grant Kwiecinski, better known as GRiZ, has been getting people grooving to his joyful brand of dance music for quite some time now. He self-released his first LP, End Of The World Party, in 2011 and, most recently, released his sixth album, Ride Waves, in April 2019. GRiZ's latest not only features his quintessential upbeat sound, but also an epic, somewhat unexpected list of collaborators, including Snoop Dogg, Matisyahu, Bootsy Collins and DRAM.

We caught up with GRiZ before he performed at the It Gets Better Project Pride party in Los Angeles to learn what Pride and being part of the LGBTQ+ means to him, among other topics. We also learned more about his career beginnings in Detroit, why giving back is so important to him, and the magic behind the collabs on Ride Waves.

The collaborators on Ride Waves are amazing. How did you choose this group going into the album?

I feel like I fell into some of these people's spaces. The Matisyahu thing, I stumbled into that because the bass player, this guy Stu Brooks who is music directing [our appearance at] Bonnaroo and SuperJam, he played with Matisyahu in their band. He's like, "We got to link you guys up." It's like, "Cool. Awesome. Yeah, that sounds great."

The Snoop Dogg thing, that was more calculated. As a kid, [I was] a major hip-hop fan.

I really love that track; what was it like working with Snoop? How did that collab manifest?

It was really, really trippy too, we got the collaboration and I got the vocals back from them. It was just the weirdest thing, it was like an email that had treasure inside of it. It was like, there's these vocals that are in this email and you open it up, it's like the briefcase in Pulp Fiction. You're like, "Oh my God."

Then working with DRAM was super awesome because I've been a huge fan of his since a few years ago; he's fresh on the scene right now. I had a chance to talk with him, talk through the collaboration with him and spin him the idea. When he sent back the work that he did on it, it just felt so right.

Sometimes you work with collaborators and stuff and you feel like you're forcing this thing to happen. You're like, "I don't know how these puzzle pieces are going to fit together but maybe we can make them work." In that case specifically [with DRAM], it felt like even before he had been involved with the song he was there from the beginning. 

The Snoop Dogg feature, that's just like ... I don't know. When does he sound bad? That just doesn't exist. That's just not a thing.

That's so cool. So in terms of the creative process, it was like you had some ideas going into it but it all came together organically.

Yeah. Absolutely. I knew specifically the kind of thing that I really wanted to hear. For me it felt like a risk because I love the music that I make. Because I make music that works for me in my life. It's what I use as a point of celebration or things I like to rock out to. Or the music that I make is stuff that I use for a contemplative healing moment, as a point of catharsis for "this is how I'm feeling. I got to get this out."

Sometimes things feel really personal and it's hard to give somebody else, to let them hold the space. So hopefully they can represent the way you're feeling. Giving a sentimental gospel tune to Wiz Khalifa was like, I don't know man, maybe he's going to be like, "Is this about weed or something like that?" [Laughs.] That was another one of the songs that I don't feel like we really forced it too much with the features for this album. Things rolled along really nicely.

I don't think that anything ever goes exactly to plan, but that's probably for the best. Because the more you try and control a situation it just gets kinda f****ery-ish. It starts to lose personality.

You got to let it go and see what comes back to you. Everything that we let go and put feelers out for, that came back to us, ended up being the most natural and organic, and ended up creating the best vibe that we could never have planned on our own. I never planned to have Wiz Khalifa on the record. The way that that turned out, it couldn't have happened better.

"To me, Pride really represents bravery. To me that bravery is represented from this unabashed, "This is who I am. These are my personal needs and the things that we deserve as a community."

Can you speak to what Pride means to you?

If you look at it historically, it means one thing. Then I feel like what people were fighting for years ago is different in context to where it is today. But that's necessary because time changes and the needs of culture shifts too. But the basic need is still there.

To me, Pride really represents bravery. To me, that bravery is represented from this unabashed [feeling of]: "This is who I am. These are my personal needs and the things that we deserve as a community." To be brave enough in situations where you're being challenged against your beliefs by other people, to be able to meet those challenges with grace, and with strength, and not give up on how you feel. Not give up your position and the things that you need. Not shy away from the challenge and speak up for yourself.

Sometimes you run into situations where there's obvious hate or there's obviously awkward situations and you're like, "Man, maybe I don't want to make this awkward." You're like, "You know what? No. I need to stand up for the way that I feel about this. You can't be hateful around me or be bigoted around me." I'm not going to stand for that or I'm not going to shy away from holding my boyfriend's hand when I'm walking down the street just because I'm worried about what somebody might think. I want to normalize this.

I think the gay community has gained a lot of visibility over the past few years because of other people's bravery. At this point it's continuing to not shy away from expressing that personal sense of self. That's important.

I love that. And it's 50 years since the Stonewall Uprising, which is crazy.

Yeah. It was a group of people who were at the Stonewall Inn. There were police raids happening in New York at gay establishments. They were like, "You can't organize this way. This is illegal." Gay people would resist or not. If you're arrested or resist then it was like, all right, this has reached a climax point. The Gay Liberation Front was the foundation that was birthed out of that. It was birthed out of people standing up for themselves and being like, "You know what? Nah. I'm not going to go quietly. We're not going to let you arrest us and kick us out of our spot."

That's the spirit that we need to continue to hold onto. It's great to celebrate around it because that's awesome. If you can take something that has a really deep historical context, and something that has a lot of weight to it, and put fun behind it then you can normalize this thing. Maybe that's what's great about throwing a party and drinking and being with your friends. It's like, let's maybe make this whole being gay thing look really f***ing extra normal and fun. We can just secretly convince everybody that it's chill. [Laughs.] That would be nice.

Well, you have some great things planned for Pride, including a party here in L.A. this afternoon with It Gets Better. Do you want to talk about any of the specific things that you're getting involved in?

Yeah. I did a partnership with MeUndies, which is important to me because The Happy Hippie Foundation is a great charity. A portion of the profits from the MeUndies Pride underwear is going towards the foundation, whose charitable outreach is to create safe spaces for young people who are gay and have been kicked out of their homes or need to link up with other people in the LGBTQ+ community. They are the resource for that and without money they can't exist. We need to give them money; if you buy cool underwear then money will be given to charities so that if kids get put out on the street because their parents aren't cool with them being gay, then they have a place to go; that's the reality of this sh*t. If you're down with the cause go buy a pair of underwear and help out.

It's almost exactly two years since you wrote your moving HuffPost letter. Can you speak to what it was like sharing that and sharing that side of you that you hadn't before with your fans?

Sure. I think I needed to get to a point where I had a substantial career behind me because I didn't want to be defined by sexual orientation. Because I think that... it would kinda suck. I want to be defined by the things that I do—not who I decide to date.

At the time, I felt like this was in a good enough spot [to come out]. I was like, "Okay, cool. I've done my rounds and I'm cool with it on a personal level." I don't even see it as a thing. It's just what life is for me. Sometimes I get these reminders that I'm like, "Okay, cool. Not everybody thinks that that's normal." There's definitely a rift there. I think that it was important now that I reached this point where I was comfortable with myself, comfortable with the music and I was like, "All right, cool. I feel like this could help people."

After writing that op-ed I've talked with a lot of kids in the GRiZ fan space mostly. Then new kids outside of it that are like, "I don't really know you as a DJ nor do I really care but I really f*** with your story. I really f*** with you as a person because I feel similarly." It's important and hopefully it's maybe inspirational for other people who are like, "I don't know if I want to do that, to come out."

That was the Harvey Milk thing, it was like we need to have people come out and represent the community, because if we are all hiding it doesn't really help. We need this movement to grow. We need to be represented in public and that will help other people find the courage within themselves. Then it's like a domino effect, hopefully. Then you'll see this thing being normalized and hopefully less people will feel outcasted because of their feelings towards their own sexuality. Suicide rates would drop. People would be living healthier lifestyles. Drug use will hopefully go down, and depression, all that kind of stuff.

I saw so much great support from the queer community. I was so surprised to hear so many kids coming out of the woodworks and being like, "Wow, that's my story too. Thank you so much for sharing that. It's helped me come to terms with the way that I feel. Now I'm having these conversations with my family and my friends." That's helping. It helped a lot of people. For me it was reaffirming as well to feel like, "All right. Cool. We're out people. That's just it." It doesn't need to be some weirdo thing. It's like, "Yeah, I'm a gay person. So what?"

I'm sure it connected on a very personal level with so many of your fans. Did any of them reach out to you and come out to you, or anything like that?

Oh, yeah. I mean, there was a few kids that I was talking to on a more personal level. A lot of people were just like, "Yo, thank you so much. Awesome. That helps a lot," but there were a few Twitter DMs and a few Instagram DMs that I read through that I was like, "All right. Cool. I want to talk this person through it." People on some serious levels. "I've been struggling with this my entire life. Since you wrote this article I feel like I finally have a jumping off spot."

Like, "How? Tell me more. Do you have any advice?" I ended up talking with a few kids. Then we did Camp Kulabunga. It gave me these tools to be able to talk about this with people, and understand on a therapeutic level how to be able to connect with people, and just have a conversation and continue a dialog that is soothing for struggling kids because I was one of those kids. I get that. Having that relatability aspect is so huge because a lot of people don't have that. I didn't have that when I was a kid. Growing up through this, there wasn't somebody I could just be like, "Hey, so tell me what that was like for you?" There just wasn't that. I didn't have that. There wasn't an example of this. I could ask my mom but she didn't f***ing know.

You spoke to it a little already, but what role has music played for you when you were going through the more challenging parts in your life? Was it always an outlet for you?

Yeah. That's always the safe space. Sometimes words don't do it, like trying to have a conversation with people. I need that emotional feeling of music. That's always been my therapy, having headphone space and listening to music loudly. I don't know what it is, it's just some physics of the sound and, I don't know, but it does it. I can tune the world out and just enjoy that. It can completely turn my day around, a good song. I don't know what it is but yeah, music is my safe space. 

I think it is for a lot of people. I also think it's really cool when artists share their personal stories, too.

You know the body weight blankets? It's like that. It feels like a cuddle in music.

"When I can't relate and when I'm feeling awkward, when I'm feeling out of place, I will always be understood and I can always feel understood through music."

A sonic cuddle.

Yeah. That's like what it is. When I can't relate and when I'm feeling awkward, when I'm feeling out of place, I will always be understood and I can always feel understood through music.

When you make music, is that something that has always been important to you? To create upbeat, joyful music?

Sometimes it's like both, right? Sometimes I'm just feeling like I need to write a song that reminds me to put a smile on or sometimes I want to write a song that's going to make me feel happy. Or sometimes I'm feeling really good and I just want to write a really happy song. Sometimes I'm feeling really sh*t and I want to write a song so that I can just get it out, some crazy dubstep something or another and I can just rage for a second because I need that.

Most of the time I'm like, "I need music that's just going to make me feel really cool." It's like putting on a dope pair of clothes and new sneakers. You're like, "Yo, all right. Cool. That's my sh*t." That's my mood most of the time. Saxophone is the instrument that I play and funk is the rhythm that makes my heart beat so it always tends to land somewhere in there.

You grew up in Detroit, which is such a breeding ground for amazing underground music. How did growing up there influence what you listen to and the music you make?

I think the big thing for me, kind of the reason why I'm playing saxophone and doing this whole DJ thing, was there was just this underground movement, and it wasn't techno. This was after techno. There was the underground, alternative pre-EDM scene for kids in downtown Detroit. They would have people like Dan Deacon come through and do shows. It was just bizarro sh*t... It was this nebulous zone of people just trying to figure out what is cool.

There weren't real paid gigs. They would just have parties in their lofts. It was this collective of kids called the Scrummage Kids. They had this thing called Scrummage University that was like, we didn't go to college, we did that. It was really inspiring to see these kids. I was producing music since I was 14 but this was now in the performance space. I was like, "I didn't know you could play this music out to people."

I'd go down to Detroit and see these kids do this stuff, experiment and have fun, and just go way beyond. That really inspired me to just do whatever I wanted. It broke all the rules for what a performance space was so I was like, "Maybe I'll do a saxophone thing. Maybe it'll be like hip-hop beats but danceable."

Then at Michigan State University, during my time there, it gave me the platform to actually do this in a performance space. They're like, now we have parties in basements where guys and girls live. They're called co-ops. There's a bunch of hippies. This was before the DJ movement in America, really. We weren't doing the EDC thing, how it is now. We weren't doing the Marshmello thing. Skrillex hadn't been a thing yet. Dubstep hadn't come to America yet.

We were figuring out this weird thing and it was like this strange electronic music performance space. Where nobody really knew what we were doing but it was cool and it was ours. It was techno, it was indie dance, it was pre-dubstep, it was hip-hop, it was electronica. I was like, "Cool. I'm going to play my music and play saxophone, and it's going to be f***ing weird." That's where that inspiration started.

In terms of giving back to your community, you do a lot. You've done six years of GRiZMAS, right?

Mm-hmm.

What are your thoughts on artists using their platform to speak up on getting involved in causes that are important to them? And what's your biggest driver in that sense right now?

I feel like it's your responsibility to do it, if you have a life that's easy. I have an easy life. I decide to work a lot. You know what I'm saying? I think it's a responsibility.

I see things in my world that are nice. If I want nice things I got to work for them or I've got to insert. If I want a nice education, I'm going to pay money and taxes or something and that's got to happen a certain way. If I want nice schools, and I want arts in education in schools, and I want to see these certain things well then I need to contribute to that, otherwise I'm just complaining about a problem. I don't want to be that kind of a person. I feel like it's my duty to contribute.

We have to do something. I have to do something. I support Seven Mile Music. They do really awesome work. They create after school music programs for kids who don't have music education during the school day. That's what we can do. This is our community and we just got to help. We got to help each other out. The entire world would be better if we could all just fucking pitch in. Just do a little bit of something. Maybe by doing that it will inspire other people to do something. I don't care what it is, just do something.

I feel that. It's a lot easier to complain, but…

It doesn't help anybody. People need help and if you're just complaining, those words aren't going to help feed people or add art to the world, or help create places where people can feel more mentally stable or have outlets for counseling. That doesn't help, us just sitting around saying, "Oh, I wish it was better." It's like, "Okay. [Laughs.] Do something and then let's party."

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