Morgan Wallen

Morgan Wallen

 

Photo: John Shearer

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Morgan Wallen On Crafting His Chart-Topping, 30-Song Project ‘Dangerous: The Double Album’

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Fast-rising country star Morgan Wallen spoke with GRAMMY.com about his record-breaking 'Dangerous: The Double Album' and the challenges of a nearly gig-free year
Jessica Nicholson
GRAMMYs
Jan 27, 2021 - 9:49 am

A single party almost cost Morgan Wallen the gig of a lifetime. Last October, the fast-rising country star, known for his '90s-era mullet, sleeveless plaid shirts and down-home vernacular, was disinvited from his "Saturday Night Live" debut after he attended a maskless party during the COVID-19 pandemic. (Wallen released an apology video and made his "SNL" debut in December.)

Wallen has four consecutive No. 1 hits on country radio under his belt: “Up Down" feat. Florida Georgia Line, “Whiskey Glasses,” “Chasin’ You” and “More Than My Hometown.” With such a controversy in the rearview, some artists might play it safe with their second album, fearing the dreaded “sophomore slump.” However, on Jan. 8, Wallen released his newest project, the 30-song Dangerous: The Double Album, on which he proved he has no problem being a rebel—personally and professionally. And it’s paying off, big time.

Last week (Jan. 17), Dangerous debuted atop the Billboard 200 albums chart. The project earned the largest streaming week ever for a country album, according to Billboard, besting Luke Combs’ record set by the expanded version of What You See Is What You Get, in October 2020. Dangerous remains at No. 1 this week, the "first country album to spend two weeks in a row at No. 1 since Chris Stapleton’s Traveller in 2015," Billboard reports.

In November, Wallen capped off 2020 by accepting the Country Music Association’s New Artist Of The Year award, which followed last summer’s soft-rock-tinged hit, “7 Summers.” The track debuted atop Billboard’s Hot Country Songs chart and shattered streaming records on Apple Music and Spotify.

Dangerous: The Double Album balances Wallen’s rowdy ways with more heartfelt, romantic material. Through countless odes to partying and endless rounds of liquid courage, he chronicles a journey of seeking love, losing love and growing up in the piercing heat of a global spotlight. Wallen steeped the album in an amalgam of country and swaggering arena rock, accented by banjos, mandolins, steel guitar and programmed beats.

The morning after debuting songs from Dangerous during his socially distanced debut headlining show at Nashville’s Ryman Auditorium, Wallen spoke with GRAMMY.com about the challenges of a nearly gig-free year, the reason why he made a double album and the Jason Isbell song that most resonates with him.

This interview has been edited and condensed for clarity.

The Ryman Auditorium concert marked your debut headlining performance at country music’s Mother Church, but also your first full concert in about ten months.
I was honestly nervous because we hadn’t played in so long, and with all new songs and everything. But it felt even better than I expected. I had intentions to talk more during the show, but the first time I started talking, I almost started bawling my eyes out, so I decided not to talk much after that. I miss [playing shows] so bad, so it was emotional for me to be up there. Seeing those people and the energy they gave out is something I have missed tremendously.

When did you first visit the Ryman Auditorium?
My first time was playing a show with Craig Wiseman to support Second Harvest Food Bank. So the first time I ever went through the doors, I got to sing a song, which is pretty cool.

If I Know Me, your debut album, is certified platinum and reached No. 1 on Billboard’s Top Country Albums chart. Still, putting out a 30-song album for your second major label project is a bold move.
With the time we are in, I was given a lot more time to work on it because I wasn’t on the road. The idea of making a double album started as a joke between my manager [Big Loud CEO Seth England] and me. We already had about 20 songs done at the beginning of 2020, but then everything happened the way it did, and I had time to add more. Some of those turned out to be my favorites on the album. We thought, “Why not?”

People need entertainment to get their minds off of what is going on, and it’s a hard time for everyone. Music is one of the only ways to get my mind off of it, so I figured most people felt the same way. We pretty much emptied the tank on this one and decided to go all-out on it.

Morgan Wallen performs at the Ryman Auditorium

Morgan Wallen performs at the Ryman Auditorium | Photo: John Shearer/Getty Images for Ryman Auditorium

Why “Dangerous” as the title track?
Ernest [Keith Smith] and I wrote that after I got into a little trouble, but we put a love story in it to make it more relatable. Honestly, it’s more of a letter to myself than it is a love story. I felt like it was a lesson I learned, and the overall premise of the message resonated with me, so I felt we should go with it as a title.

How have you handled writing songs via Zoom during the pandemic?
I did a couple of Zoom writes, then we figured out we could get mobile testing done, so we all made sure we were good before we would write in the same room. I wrote with the same group of guys a lot, so we had a pretty good trust with each other. Zoom writing is not something I enjoy doing at all. It’s hard for me to feel the same energy or vibe. I think I wrote two songs on Zoom. One was a failure, and we didn’t finish it. The other song I wrote with Thomas Rhett and was not a failure [laughs]. There are certain things you can’t replace and for me, writing in person is one of them.

You have performed Jason Isbell’s “Cover Me Up” live, and you included a version of it for this project. What is it about that song that speaks to you?
That was the first Jason Isbell song I heard. I think that’s a pretty solid introduction to anyone, and then I discovered the rest of his catalog. The song’s arrangement is beautiful. It reminded me of my mom and dad. My dad used to be pretty wild and a little bit reckless, kind of not caring about anything. But he loved my mom, and he chose her over all that, so it reminded me of their story.

My guitar player and I would warm up by playing [“Cover Me Up”], and people would stop by and say, “Dang, what is that?” I was kind of disappointed that people in my lane, my part of life, didn’t know that song, and I thought they should. I figured the best way for me to spread that song was to do my own version.

Doing a cover like that is risky. You run the risk of the original artist not appreciating it. It took me a while to decide to do it, but my team and everyone made me feel comfortable. I appreciate Jason giving me the support he has on it.

You’ve had some ups and downs over the past year. Did your dad have any encouragement or advice for you during that time?
He felt for me because he had been in kind of a similar situation, without having to learn it in the spotlight. He just let me know he was there for me and that I would get through it. Just a lot of encouragement for me during that time, which meant more to me than anything he could have done.

Before the pandemic and this new album’s success, your star was already skyrocketing. You were set to open shows for Luke Bryan in 2020. But as you hopefully return to touring in 2021, how will that look for you?
I will still go out and open for my buddy Luke. We are honoring those dates, and we have plans to start doing our own arena shows as soon as we can get back to touring.

“Livin’ The Dream” starts with the gut-punch line, “Mama don't pray for my success anymore/But mama still prays for me.” The song addresses the stressors that often come with fame—the loneliness, the alcohol, the grueling schedules. Did you have any second thoughts about including it on the album?
I definitely had some second thoughts about it. I didn’t want people to worry about me. I didn’t want people to think it was a cry for help. We wrote that song a good while ago before I even knew the real meaning behind it. It was almost a prophetic song, in a way. You don’t always wake up pumped to be in the spotlight, but you always have to be “on.” That part can get a little tiring.

I don’t feel that way most of the time. Most of the time, I feel blessed to do something I love, but it’s not all fun and games. We wanted to write it from an honest perspective, and that’s one of the most real lyrics I’ve been part of creating.

There are several references to hometowns and small towns throughout Dangerous. You went to Gibbs High School, where Kenny Chesney attended. Did knowing that one of country music’s most significant artists came from your area give you confidence that you could try to pursue music, too?
I was so caught up in baseball in high school. I still sang and stuff, but I was supposed to play in college. Once baseball got taken away [due to an injury], I started writing my own songs. Between my family’s encouragement and knowing that someone from a little high school like I’m from could do it, that played a part in my lack of doubt.

I’ve never really let negative thoughts get in the way. I never let the idea of failure enter my mind, and I still don’t. I think that’s important for anything you want to achieve.

The Unbreakable Margo Price

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Ingrid Andress

Ingrid Andress

Photo: Jess Williams

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Meet The First-Time GRAMMY Nominee: Ingrid Andress On Finding Her Sound—And Breaking Country Norms With It

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Following the release of her 2020 debut album, 'Lady Like,' rising country star Ingrid Andress, who is up for three GRAMMYs this month, explains why having her breakout year during a pandemic worked out for her
Taylor Weatherby
GRAMMYs
Mar 1, 2021 - 9:49 am

Despite the abundant darkness of 2020, Ingrid Andress had the biggest year of her life. Along with honors like inclusion on Forbes 30 Under 30 and big-time TV performances, including "Colbert" and "Today," the 29-year-old singer/songwriter celebrated a country radio No. 1 with the heartfelt breakup ballad "More Hearts Than Mine" and the release of her debut album, Lady Like. Both the single and the album earned Andress her first-ever GRAMMY nominations, for Best Country Song and Best Country Album, respectively, as well as a coveted Best New Artist nod, at the 2021 GRAMMY Awards show. (Ahead of GRAMMY night, Andress will participate in the Recording Academy's inaugural "Women In The Mix" virtual celebration on International Women's Day, Monday, March 8.)

Andress has already achieved so much, she's joked about retiring before she even turns 30. "Honestly, I do think I've peaked," Andress says with a laugh. "I've accomplished all the things that I've wanted to do, so it's kind of like, 'Should I get into the restaurant business? What is next for me?'"

Though she has been working on her cooking skills while in quarantine, Andress' success thus far proves that she's too good at songwriting to give it up just yet. Even before she had hits of her own, the singer/songwriter co-penned cuts for pop stars like Charli XCX, Fletcher and Bebe Rexha and landed in the studio with Alicia Keys and Sam Hunt. And as the only country act in the Best New Artist category this year, Andress has made a name for herself as an artist, too.

Ingrid Andress gave GRAMMY.com a call to talk about her beginnings, her transition from behind the scenes to center stage, and her hope for a female-driven future. (Don't worry, Ingrid fans: Her retirement isn't part of it).

Ingrid Andress | First-Time GRAMMY Nominee

How does it feel to be the only country artist in the Best New Artist category?

I still feel like that was an accident. [Laughs.] It's sort of a mindf--k because I'm still so new—like, new new—nobody knows who I am because I haven't been able to tour or anything. I feel honored that I am doing something that represents Nashville. 

I'm glad that I get to represent a part of country music that maybe people don't necessarily think of when they think of country—you know, a lot of people think of it as like, beer and trucks. I'm glad that people realize that I don't have to sing about beer and trucks for people to like it.

Although "More Hearts Than Mine" was released in 2019, last year felt like you established that you weren't going to be a one-hit-wonder with the release of your album Lady Like. What was it like to have your breakout year happen in a time when you could hardly even be face-to-face with people?

I'm probably one of the only people I know who can be like, "2020 was my year." But I feel like it might have been for the better. There's just so much hype that goes with all that celebration, and to me, it's about the music and how people are connecting to it. Last year was more about that authentic connection to the music. It was cool to hear people's stories of how they hear their own lives in whatever I was saying.

Your mom was a piano teacher, so I assume that's how you got started with it. But what ultimately made it feel like your instrument?

It was a love-hate relationship at the beginning. But when you live with your piano teacher, you don't have a choice. We made a deal where if I got to a certain level of piano, then I'd get to pick whatever instrument I wanted. 

Naturally, I picked drums because I was going through a punk and metal phase. I was like, "I just want to bang on some s--t." I got more into [playing] piano in high school. I was homeschooled for the majority of my education, so high school was confusing. Piano felt like therapy. It was just a great outlet emotionally.

After getting your start writing for other artists, what made you decide to pursue being an artist yourself?

There was a song that I wrote that was very personal to me. I didn't want anybody to have it, but I still had to give it away. When I started writing about my personal feelings, it became harder to picture somebody else singing them. 

So I thought, "You know what, if I don't want to give these away, I probably need to sing them and put them out myself." I knew I wanted to be an artist, but I also didn't think I was [fit for it] because many of the artists I worked with didn't know what they wanted to say. It came out of the natural progression of me finding what I wanted to write about.

Read: Get Lost In The Best Country Song Nominees | 2021 GRAMMYs

So how did you find your sound after that?

I think it was going back and forth between Nashville and LA to write. I've been doing that for five years now. The writing process is so different for each city—writing country music in Nashville, you're all sitting in a room with guitars and talking about lyrics and how to set up the song. Whereas in LA, you go in, there's a track playing, it's on a loop, and you just have to sing melodies over it. 

Nobody's talking about lyrics. My sound came from learning how to combine those two things. I would write songs that would straddle the line, and people would say, "We can't pitch it to a country artist, but it also has smart storyteller lyrics. And it's not poppy enough for pop."

So the songs just sort of created their lane that nobody could cut except for me.

You're part of a groundbreaking GRAMMY year for women in country, as the Best Country Album category—which includes Lady Like—is all projects from solo women or female-fronted groups for the first time. Has it felt like there's been a shift in the way women are supported and recognized in the genre?

It's still kind of slow, but the female turnout in the GRAMMY [categories] this year was such a breath of fresh air. Then you look at country radio, and it's white dudes. It brought me a lot of joy to see the contrast and how opposite it is to what country radio is doing right now. But to see all these women validated for their great work is a huge statement. Even if it's not on the radio, it's still acknowledged as a beautiful piece of art.

I feel like there's sort of a female movement and confident, feminine energy happening in every genre right now. Do you think that, too?

For sure. I hope more women start saying how they feel about things because chances are, we're all going to relate to it. Even if it's something that people feel is controversial, I'm like, please bring it on. The more controversy, the better. We've evolved so much, and I feel like it's our jobs as creatives to pull the mirror up to what's happening in society. It's going to happen eventually, so we might as well start coming out and being honest about how we feel. 

You hold true to that on Lady Like, and now you're being rewarded for it.

I'm just here to write about my feelings and hope people feel the same way. Especially in this past year, when everything was so divided and chaotic, I feel like the response to my music was a nice reminder that we all could come together by listening to music that is relatable to all of us.

Meet The First-Time GRAMMY Nominee: Lauren Patten On The Timelessness Of "Jagged Little Pill" And Owning Her Identity On The Broadway Stage

Norah Jones

Norah Jones

Photo: Vivian Wang

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Norah Jones On Her Two-Decade Evolution, Channeling Chris Cornell & Her First-Ever Live Album, ''Til We Meet Again'

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On ''Til We Meet Again,' Norah Jones and her band confidently twist selections from her 20-year songbook—and an unexpected Soundgarden cover—into fascinating new shapes
Morgan Enos
GRAMMYs
Apr 12, 2021 - 7:32 am

Just over a week after Chris Cornell wailed Led Zeppelin's "In My Time of Dying" at Detroit's Fox Theater mere hours before taking his life, Norah Jones stepped onto that same stage. Near the end of the set, her band took five, and she sang Soundgarden's "Black Hole Sun" onstage for the first time—and maybe the last.

Jones had spent the day woodshedding the song in her dressing room. "I was kind of nervous," the eight-time GRAMMY winner and 17-time nominee admits to GRAMMY.com. "But I thought, 'We're going to send some love to him and do this song of his.'" Despite "Black Hole Sun" not immediately being in Jones' wheelhouse, the performance was a spectral success. "It was probably one of the most beautiful live moments I've ever had," she says. "I don't know if his ghost was in the room or what, but it carried me through that song like I could have never imagined."

"It's just one of those moments I'm really glad we could capture," Jones adds, "because I don't even know if I'll play that song again."

"Black Hole Sun'' concludes her first-ever live album, 'Til We Meet Again, which drops April 16 on Blue Note. If Jones hadn't recorded all of her gigs for the past eight years, each of its 14 tracks could have evaporated with the final piano chord. Sumptuous versions of her staples like "I've Got to See You Again" (in France, in 2018) and "Sunrise" (in Argentina, in 2019) demonstrate how Jones has developed her improvisatory muscles over her two-decade career.

Jones curated 'Til We Meet Again as a response to COVID and a nearly concert-free year. Now that vaccines are rolling out (her second shot is around the corner), she's ready to jump back on stage when the time is right. Until then, for those unaware of Jones' live prowess, this impeccably recorded live album is more than enough to chew on.

GRAMMY.com caught up with Norah Jones over Zoom to discuss the origin of 'Til We Meet Again, the thrill of collaborating with the greatest jazz musicians alive and her hot-and-cold relationship with the word "jazz."

This interview has been lightly edited for clarity.

I'm curious about the timing of 'Til We Meet Again. Had the idea for a live record been percolating for a while, or was it a response to a year without gigs?

More the latter. I'd done a couple of live DVD types of things where you plan to do it and you record it with a camera crew, but this came about [because] I was listening to one of the last shows we did. We've recorded every show for the last eight years because… technology, you know [chuckles]. It's easy to do!

And so I was listening to one of the last shows we did and it just felt so good, especially in the absence of having access to live music and playing shows. So I wanted to put it out. I just decided then, last summer. And then we decided to sort of comb through some of the more similar band-lineup shows to that show to make sure we get the best version of everything, basically.

Where was that show you mentioned?

That show was in Rio. It was in December 2019. We did a South American tour with a trio, which has been a fun setup for me recently. More piano-based.

Who was the rhythm section? Was Brian [Blade] on drums?

Yeah, Brian on drums. In December, it was Jesse Murphy on bass, but the first tour I did with that setup was with Chris Thomas on bass and Brian on drums. And actually, Pete Remm was on organ. This was, like, 2018, maybe. So we went back to those first shows I did with that setup and took some of that stuff because it was a really special opening-up of the songs with that setup.

I love trio albums, by the way. I've interviewed people like Bill Frisell and Vijay Iyer and they talked a lot about them. Do you have any favorites?

I mean, I've always loved the Bill Evans Trio [Sunday at the Village Vanguard]. That's pretty great. Classic. And I love some of the classic piano-player/singing trios. Like, Shirley Horn had a great thing. I love hearing Nina Simone when it's just bass, drums and her. Even if there's a bigger band, I love when it's stripped back.

All you need is Nina.

Really, all you need is Nina! But when the drum kicks in with that light, little groove, it's pretty great.

While listening to 'Til We Meet Again, I was more absorbed in the songs than noticing how many instruments there were. Is it mostly trios or are there quartets and such?

Well, it's mostly a trio, but I did have an organ on quite a bit of it. For me, that's a lot different than having a guitar. I don't know why. The thing missing from this album that has been present, I feel like, for my whole career, is the guitar. Guitar has been a big part of most of the songs I do. Not all of them. But at least touring, this is the first time I've toured without a guitar. Over the last few years, I've dabbled without a guitar. I mean, I play a little guitar.

This album had a few different instruments on it, though, because the songs were in Rio where we had a percussionist sit in and also a flute player. Jorge [Continentino] sat in. Then, on one song, Jesse Harris sat in on guitar in Rio, as well.

Not that he's on this record, but on the topic of the organ, I was just thinking about how you've played with Dr. Lonnie Smith.

Oh, yeah. He played on Day Breaks. That was amazing.

When you survey the last two decades, how would you say you've developed as a live performer?

I mean, it's all just an evolution. And I'll continue to change, right? I think what's cool about this album is that I'm close to it. I've been changing and adapting for the last 20 years, but to someone who might not have seen me live recently or at all, maybe it represents a whole different side of these songs. 

The way you guys are taking control of the rhythms, shifting and shaping them, is really nice.

Yeah. Brian's so fun to play with. It's a joy, you know? And also, the nice thing about playing with a trio is that you can go to different places without planning it out. It's a little easier without multiple chordal instruments.

Obviously, Brian is so versed in that format. That excellent album with Chick Corea and Christian McBride, [2021's GRAMMY-winning] Trilogy 2, comes to mind.

Brian is amazing. He will go wherever the moment takes him in the music. He's not tied to anything. But he'll also lay down the sickest groove [laughs], you know what I mean? So, he's the best of everything.

I get the sense that you're just as much a fan of your accompanists as the people in the audience.

Oh, definitely. I saw Brian play when I was in high school. I went to see him play with Joshua Redman. It might have been Chris Thomas on bass? I remember because I was telling them about it and they were mad at me for saying [naive voice] "Oh, I was in high school!" They're only a few years older than me. But I've been a fan of Brian's for a long time, now, absolutely.

I was just thinking about how you're from the singer/songwriter realm and Joni Mitchell is, too, obviously. But she played with the greatest jazz musicians in her day and now you're doing the same. That must feel pretty cool.

Yeah, some of my favorite recordings of Wayne Shorter are on Joni's albums! But, I mean, I come from a jazz background. I came from that into the singer-songwriter world, kind of. So I feel like going back to playing with people who come from that world also feels very natural.

Norah Jones

Norah Jones performing on "​Saturday Night Live" in 2002. Photo: Dana Edelson/NBCU Photo Bank/NBCUniversal via Getty Images​ 

You totally don't have to address this if you don't want to, but back in 2002, it must have been annoying to have to prove your jazz roots to people.

Not really. I mean, I felt very conflicted about the jazz roots 20 years ago because I felt like my album was a departure. I feel like people called me a jazz singer when that wasn't representative of the actual album. I didn't want people to not realize what "jazz" was. It was kind of loaded.

I used to be part of the jazz police [laughs]. Like, I used to be that kid. Then, my album was so successful and it really wasn't jazz. It was a foray into different things for me. I didn't want other people to think it was for jazz, for jazz's sake. I was like, "No! Billie Holiday! Not me!" Does that make sense?

Of course. There's folk, soul, country…

The genre titles are tricky for me. But I don't really care anymore. And I didn't then, that much. I just felt like it was confusing.

I haven't met a single musician in the jazz world that's fully comfortable with the word. They're always trying to push back on it, and rightfully so. They've been doing that since the '40s or earlier.

I guess! Have they? Was it weird for people back then? It seems like back then, it was just what it was.

I've read that Miles Davis considered it tantamount to a racial slur.

Really! I feel like these days, I'm more connected to those roots of mine than I was. I feel like for a while, I kind of strayed from that world and was excited to be all things. And now, I'm really excited to have that basis in what I do. I just don't like genres. I find them kind of silly. Sorry, GRAMMYs! [laughs]

No apologies! To me, genres are only useful if you're in a record store and you don't know what to buy.

Exactly.

Before I jump back into the record, are you a Yusef Lateef fan?

[excitedly] You know what? I just started listening to him this week! It's amazing! It kind of sounds like that Éthiopiques stuff a little bit. Where's he from?

He was from Detroit.

What did he say about [the word "jazz"]?

I've been told he gave a dissertation where he brought up representatives from the dictionary and challenged them on the word "jazz," because it had connotations of being dirty or low-grade, with meanings ranging from "nonsense" to "fornication."

I get that. The connotations are that it's not as serious an art form, basically. It's such a silly thing, right? It's not silly at all—I get it—but even my own feelings about it are so silly sometimes.

Well, what are your feelings about it?

It's just music, you know? To get hung up on a word, I think, is not about the music. I respect what he's saying. I'm not talking bad about him. I'm just saying that in general, the whole conversation about it is so funny.

I like that Bird called it "modern music" instead.

I love that. I'm in for that.

So, I was going to ask about which of these gigs were particularly memorable for you, but you sort of answered that question when you said it grew out of the Rio show. What about the others, though? Any interesting stories attached to them?

Actually, the France gig was one of the first gigs we did with this band that felt so good. The audience was great. I remember after that show, thinking, "Ah, man! That was awesome!" So when we were going back to think about shows, I said, "Remember that gig in Perpignan that was so good? Do you have that recorded?" And he did. So that was part of it.

And then the Ohana Festival was so special because it was just a big, huge, outdoor festival, which we hadn't really done out with this band. I didn't know how it would go over, but it was awesome. We actually did the song "It Was You," which is from an EP I put out a couple of years ago [2019's Begin Again], and I don't even think it had come out yet. Even if it had, it wasn't something a lot of people had. I don't think it was a hit! [laughs].

So, we played this song from it and the audience didn't know it at all, but the reaction was everything I've ever wanted for that song. It was so great. I'm just so glad we captured that too, you know?

It's the energy feedback! That's what we're missing when we're singing for each other through tinny phone speakers.

Yeah, exactly. During this pandemic, I've made playlists to just feel good, and one of them had a Bob Marley Live track on it. Every time the song comes on and I feel the energy of that, it just makes me kind of electric, you know? It makes me so happy. That's what I was trying to capture. That's what the Rio show had, 100%.

The Brazilian audience is so vocal as well, which helps, but it just had that energy. We were trying to keep that throughout the album. So, there were some songs that there were two great versions of, but one where you could just feel the live energy more. We would choose the energy one. We tried to keep that going.

Norah Jones

Norah Jones performing in Florence, Massachusetts, in 2019. Photo: David Barnum

I love the cover of "Black Hole Sun" here. It's unexpected coming from you, but it fits like a glove. Can you talk about your relationship with Chris Cornell's music?

Yeah, I grew up listening to Soundgarden and loved it. I was a kid of the '90s, you know? It was on the air at all times. I got to meet him once. He was super sweet. We shared a dressing room bathroom at a festival [chuckles]. At the Bridge School [Benefit], actually. He was such a great singer, so I was a fan. 

And when he died, we happened to be playing the same theater the night he died, in Detroit. I think we were the first people to play it since he played there that week. My guitar player told me that morning that this is where he had played. So, I thought it would be nice to play "Black Hole Sun" as a tribute. 

I practiced it all day in my dressing room. I was kind of nervous, but I thought, "We're going to send some love to him and do this song of his." It was probably one of the most beautiful live moments I've ever had. The song is beautiful and, somehow, the music, his spirit—I don't know if his ghost was in the room or what, but it carried me through that song like I could have never imagined.

It's just one of those moments I'm really glad we could capture because I don't even know if I'll play that song again. It was such a special time to play it and I don't know if I could ever recapture that. Just the vibe in the room, you know.

I feel like a different musician might do a more melodramatic version of "Black Hole Sun." I appreciate that you just inhabited the melody and let it speak for itself because I think he was a Beatles- or Kurt Cobain-level melody writer.

Oh, totally. I'd known that song forever, but I'd never tried to play it. And when I was learning it that day, I was like, "Holy crap! This song is crazy! It's so good; it's so unique; it's so interesting." And the lyrics are so beautiful as well.

What's your plan for 2021 and beyond now that we're all hopefully getting our vaccines? I'm sure you're raring to return to the stage.

Yeah, I'm so excited! I get my second shot in a few weeks. I'm really excited to return to the stage, but I don't know when. I'm just going to wait until things completely return. I'm going to let everyone who is really raring to go, go. I can't imagine doing it before 2022, but I'm down if it happens! [laughs] I'm ready!

The problem might be that everyone will want to go back out at once.

Yeah. And also, I'm cool for a minute. I don't know. I don't want to cobble it together. The half-capacity thing… I'll go to those shows, but I don't know. I don't want to jump the gun myself, but I'm excited.

Gregory Porter On Bakersfield's Hidden Jazz Scene, Writing Spiritually During COVID-19 & Why Love Is Underrated

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Yoshiki

Yoshiki

Photo: Yoshiki Foundation America

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Yoshiki On Teaming With MusiCares To Address Mental Health & His New Disney+ Special

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"Suicide is not only one person's problem," X Japan drummer Yoshiki tells GRAMMY.com. "The people around the person have to live with that pain, and I'm one of them"
Bryan Reesman
MusiCares
Mar 29, 2021 - 7:30 am

Drummer, pianist and X Japan bandleader Yoshiki has lived a life that countless musicians dream of. His band has sold more than 30 million albums globally, toured across Asia and Europe, headlined Madison Square Garden, and sold out the massive Tokyo Dome a record 18 times. 

Still, he's aware of the plight of others far less fortunate than himself. Eleven years ago, Yoshiki founded the Yoshiki Foundation America for the purpose of aiding in various causes, and since the X Japan documentary We Are X came out in 2016, he has been open about his personal struggles with depression and suicidal thoughts after his father committed suicide when he was 10 years old. 

His latest endeavor with MusiCares is an annual $100,000 grant from his foundation to aid those in the music industry who are coping with or have been affected by depression and suicide. Funds will be used to help those coping with depression or suicidal thoughts as well as survivors of suicide loss.

Yoshiki spoke to GRAMMY.com about the grant and his recent Disney+ special, "Disney My Music Story." He also discussed his YouTube Originals concert and upcoming documentary "Under The Sky" featuring guest performances by St. Vincent, The Chainsmokers, Sarah Brightman, Scorpions and other artists.

For many years, you've been involved in philanthropic endeavors. When did you realize you could use your rock star status for good deeds, and what was the cause that compelled you to action?

There was the Kobe earthquake 25 years ago. It was a pretty big earthquake. Over 10 schools lost their buildings, so we [X Japan] donated pianos for their music classes. I think that was the first time we did something. Since then, if an earthquake or something happens, I donate here and there. Then, in 2010, I created my own foundation to keep supporting people [in various ways]. 

You've given money, but you've also given something of yourself. Ten years ago, you donated the crystal piano that you played at Tokyo Dome shows with X Japan for victims of tsunami and earthquake devastation. How hard was it to let go of something so personal?

Around that time, I tried to figure out: what's the best way to support people? With people like us, it's not just that you're donating something to someone. What we do can also spread, right? Artist A did this, Artist B did that. 

So because we are in the position that the media can talk about this, and also the way we do it, people can understand who needs some help. By donating such a memorable piano, people around the world can notice, "Those people need support." I thought that was a very effective way to support even more than what I could do.

Your current MusiCares partnership is a grant to raise awareness for mental health issues and suicide prevention. What inspired you to create this grant?

Since my father committed suicide, I became very suicidal. I was looking for the moment to die, but I couldn't kill myself. I was already playing piano when my father was playing piano. I was composing already. I just used this darkness and pain and converted it into art, so that's how I've been surviving. 

Then, my band member [Hide] also passed away. And another member, Taiji, committed suicide, and it really hit me again. Again, I became suicidal. I've always been suicidal. When I help people, somehow I'm also being helped at the same time. That's supporting me too. I have my own problems.

How does the grant work?

As of now, I donate a certain amount of money every year so that music industry people can have a counselor or a psychiatrist to support them – somebody who has suicidal thoughts or depression, or somebody who lost their family member or close one to this kind of problem. 

Because committing suicide is not only one person's problem. The people around the person have to live with that pain, and I'm one of them. The cause can support those people as well.

You've said it before: For the people who are left behind, what do they do?

Exactly. It's very different than if somebody… Death is death, after all. [People can] die from some kind of an accident or sickness. But committing suicide is their own choice. So if your friend or family member [did it]...why couldn't I stop that? 

In my father's case: Was I a bad son? I still think about it [after] all these years.

How hard has it been to discuss these issues in your own life? And then how else do you want to get the word out about dealing with them? Do you want to do public speaking?

Well, before the film We Are X, I did not talk about that much. It's not something cool to talk about, right? But after the film was out, a lot of people came to me and because of that, because of my story, I decided to live. I decided not to take my life. 

Like, wow, my story or the music or combination is supporting people. It's still painful to talk about it, but the story can support people and help people's lives... I don't know, I'm not good at making speeches in front of a lot of people. I'm good at rocking. [laughs] I would love to support more people's lives.

You said you've channeled some of your pain into your music. Do you channel that as much into your classical music as you do your rock music?

I think a combination of both. So yes, sometimes I keep playing the piano to contain my sadness, but also playing drums or even breaking drums to just contain my anger. Because of that environment, I was kind of saved, I guess. If you go out and start smashing things on stage, people like it, but you cannot do it in real life.

Read: Yoshiki Donates $100k To MusiCares COVID-19 Relief Fund "To Help My Colleagues Who Might Be Struggling"

You've teamed up with MusiCares a few times before. Why is this alliance so important to you, and why do you feel such a connection with this organization?

They support the music industry to which I belong. Sometimes, people may have a hard time understanding our situation. We are not special, we are the same as you, but the way we act and perform on stage, people may think we are something different. 

At the same time, our image is supposed to be bigger than life. We don't have to live that way, but we are also as vulnerable as anyone. In this gap, I sometimes get lost. It's so hard to just show a weaker side sometimes. All those MusiCares activities, [from] education to disaster relief to other things, I think they are doing amazing things.

Many musicians quietly deal with mental health issues. It's the same thing in Hollywood. There are a lot of actors who are dealing with them but don't tell others. People don't often like to show "weakness." How do you think MusiCares will be effective in working with this grant program to reach out to the music community about these issues?

Musicians [and] artists are supposed to help people through music or through art or film, but we also have problems. MusiCares supports the artists, the artists can support people, so it's a very important role MusiCares has especially right now. Our hope is towards the end of the tunnel, but we still haven't left the tunnel yet.

Yoshiki

Yoshiki presenting a check to MusiCares. Photo courtesy of Yoshiki Foundation America.

I've been hearing that the pandemic has been very hard for people struggling with depression and addiction. You and I are used to being hermits when we work. You can sit in the studio, I can write in my office. But other people are struggling with not having that human contact. Zoom calls are great, but it's nice to see people in person. Has anyone mentioned that to you at all?

I'm kind of used to the isolation, being alone [in] the composition process. I haven't gone out to eat in one year. It's very strange. I thought I could be just by myself, like one year without seeing anyone, but it's feeling strange. If I start feeling like that, I can imagine other people. I love loneliness. I used to love loneliness. But this is strange. I talked to some of my musician friends who were acting fine on Zoom calls, but I could see through it.

You've talked about your suicidal thoughts and mental health issues. Do you think that more musicians will be inspired to open up about those things seeing that there are major figures such as yourself being very public about this? And have you noticed that?

Yeah. Sometimes we also see musicians kill themselves. I think that being on stage and being off stage, we get lost in between somehow. When I met David Bowie a long time ago, I asked him, "Where do you draw the line [between] your real life and life on stage?" He couldn't answer it. He said, "That's a good question."

The Yoshiki Foundation America is based in the States, but you have an international reach. You've donated to earthquake and tsunami relief, COVID relief, childhood cancer research and Meals On Wheels. Are there any other charitable causes that are close to your heart that you want to get involved with?

Oh, yes, we are also donating to environmental issues, sustainability issues. We are learning more and more how important they are.

I've heard that when Hide was alive, he had been helping out an X Japan fan who was terminally ill, and then you took over following his unexpected death. Could you tell us about that story?

I think the Make-A-Wish Foundation in Japan approached Hide. There was this huge Hide fan named Mayuko who had bone marrow disease. [After] Hide passed away, I didn't know what to do. I was organizing some disaster relief, but I took over the position. I started supporting her to the end of her life. Hide inspired me. She was very strong to the last minute. She was very inspirational.

I believe you're the first Japanese music artist to have a Disney+ special in America which includes two of your Disney covers, "Let It Go" and "Can You Feel the Love Tonight." I'm curious how that came about?

I'm very grateful that Disney+ approached me to do my life story and incorporate the Disney story. That documentary is almost 90% Japanese. I thought it was created for Disney+ Japan but Disney+ picked it up, and I was kind of surprised by that. I think my fans requested it. I don't know how that happened actually because it's almost like a foreign film [with subtitles].

I feel like Japan and other Asian countries have done well in response to the coronavirus. What do you think we can learn over here about the Eastern response to the pandemic?

This COVID-19 situation is all about, not "I'm first," [but] "I care about you first.". So wearing the mask or staying home is not for you [but] for your friends. That kind of thought. Some diseases [like smallpox] completely disappeared because our ancestors [were] vaccinated. That's why we don't have to deal with that. 

So, we are doing this for the next generation, or your friends or your family or people around the world. That's most important. Then secondary, also your life. That's how I think. I'm not saying you should it do this way, but those are my thoughts.

How MusiCares' Music On A Mission Honored The Resilience Of The Music Community

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Apollo Theater

The Apollo Theater

Photo: Roy Rochlin/Getty Images

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From Small Stages To The GRAMMY Stage: How Four Venue Professionals Became Presenters At The 2021 GRAMMY Awards Show

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Operators and staff at the Station Inn, the Troubadour, the Apollo Theater and Hotel Café appeared during the 2021 GRAMMY Awards show to petition viewers for help—and promise an epic party for them if they do
Morgan Enos
GRAMMYs
Mar 24, 2021 - 8:43 am

The Recording Academy reimagined everything about the 2021 GRAMMY Awards show on a more intimate scale, and the choice of presenters was no different. When it came time to announce the Best Country Album winner, the person who appeared on screen wasn't a slick Nashville superstar, but a soft-spoken, older man who's unrecognizable to a global audience but beloved in the Music City. His name was J.T. Gray, and he grinned ear-to-ear on national TV.

In a segment recorded a month prior, Gray showed the camera crew around the Station Inn, the 145-person-capacity bluegrass venue he'd owned since 1981. Despite the room receiving almost no income for a year due to the live music industry shutdown caused by the COVID-19 pandemic, Gray was rosy about the future. "Getting to reopen the Station Inn, that's going to be a celebration like never before," he promised. "It's going to be a big party." He then announced the winner, Miranda Lambert, to the world. Gray was naturally quiet and reserved, a closed book. Not after that shoot, though.

"He was just beside himself the whole time," Jeff Brown, the Station Inn's marketing director, tells GRAMMY.com. "He just never believed it was happening. He just didn't believe that his little venue was being recognized on that kind of scale, that those many people in a place with the GRAMMYs and the Recording Academy's recognition actually paid attention. He just couldn't believe it." On Sunday, March 14, Gray astonishedly watched himself on CBS. The following Saturday, he passed away after a struggle with compounding health problems.

Gray might not get to attend the "big party" when things open up. But 9 million people heard his message.

For a year, venues worldwide have been hanging on by a thread: struggling to pay their rent, waiting in vain for federal aid, and given no clear finish line as to when they can reopen. That's why, with the Recording Academy's blessing, Executive Producer Ben Winston asked Gray, as well as representatives from the Troubadour and Hotel Café in Los Angeles and the Apollo Theater in New York City, to present at the 63rd GRAMMY Awards and talk about their economic struggles during the pandemic. Together, they sounded a shared refrain to the world: We matter to our communities, and we need help.

The venues that spoke their piece during the 63rd GRAMMY Awards were members of the National Independent Venue Association (NIVA). An assemblage of independent venue owners and promoters from around the country, NIVA formed directly in response to the 2020 lockdown. "We figured we'd better find a way to come together and lobby for federal assistance," Audrey Schaefer, a board member and the Communications Director for NIVA, tells GRAMMY.com. "Because otherwise, we're all going under."

The Steel Wheels At Station Inn

The Steel Wheels at Station Inn in 2015. Photo: Erika Goldring/Getty Images for Americana Music via Getty Images

Last year, NIVA, along with the Recording Academy and other music organizations, lobbied Congress via the Save Our Stages Act and succeeded. On Dec. 27, the decree became the Shuttered Venue Operators Grant and passed along with the COVID relief package. "In that grant fund is $16 billion," Schaefer says. "For an organization that didn't exist before … nobody gave us any hopes of being able to secure that kind of funding. But we did. We got the law passed."

However, venues have not yet seen that money. "We understand that the applications will start at the beginning of April," she adds with relief in her voice.

In the meantime, Scheafer mulled over how best to convey to the world the existential crises venues face. "I was thinking that the GRAMMYs couldn't possibly be at the Beverly Hilton like it normally is—in a big ballroom—because we can't be together," she says. "I thought, 'What if the GRAMMYs were to have the award show, and instead of having all the performances under one roof, they were to have them in independent venues?'"

To try and give this idea legs, Schaefer reached out to Daryl Friedman, Chief Advocacy Officer of the Recording Academy's Advocacy division. "He said, 'Listen, Audrey, I think that's a great idea, but they have a million great ideas. So, let me take it to them and we'll see what happens,'" she recalls. Schaefer persistently followed up. "I kept asking Daryl, 'What do you think? What are you hearing?'"

But unbeknown to her, the Recording Academy and the production team were already independently planning to highlight independent venues and their employees as an advocacy initiative and add a personal moment to the broadcast. "And then I found out that, oh my gosh, they do want to do it," she adds with awe.

Billie Eilish

Billie Eilish at the Troubadour in 2019. Photo: Neilson Barnard/Getty Images for SiriusXM

Granted, the Recording Academy didn't agree to host performances at independent venues. But Schaefer calls the idea they decided to go with "so much better." Instead, venue professionals would take viewers on a tour of their workplaces, illustrating their value to their communities and why they desperately need help. Participants included the Station Inn's Gray; Rachelle Erratchu, the night manager at the Troubadour; Billy Mitchell, the tour guide and overall house cat at the Apollo Theater in Harlem; and Candice Fox, a bartender at the Hotel Café in Hollywood.

For Erratchu, the problem extends further than keeping the lights on at the Troubadour; the entire live music ecosystem is in trouble. "We need everybody else to survive so that we can survive," she tells GRAMMY.com. "If we don't exist and all the other venues across the country don't exist, the tour circuit as we know it and have relied on it for decades won't exist anymore."

For Billy Mitchell, the Historical Tour Manager and overall global representative of the Apollo Theater who has earned the title of "Mr. Apollo," his job isn't a means to an end; he lives and breathes it. Mitchell's time at the Apollo began in 1965 when he ran errands for James Brown and his band. During the telecast, Mitchell relates a funny story of how the Godfather of Soul sent him all the way home to the Bronx to get his report card, threatening to put his job on ice if he didn't get better grades.

COVID forced the Apollo to temporarily furlough some its staff. To be forced to stop, it was heartbreaking, to be honest with you," Mitchell tells GRAMMY.com. "I give tours to people from all over the world, and they're unable to visit because of COVID restrictions and things like that." While the not-for-profit has offered digital programming in the meantime, most of it has been free as not to burden fans. Thankfully, at press time, all staff members have returned full-time.

Billy Mitchell

Billy Mitchell at the Apollo Theater in 2009. Photo: Jemal Countess/WireImage via Getty Images​

The Apollo has been lucky, in a sense; corporate and private donations have kept it afloat. Still, they're not out of the woods yet. "Donations are needed so that when we do reopen, we can pump out those great shows and bring back our staff," Mitchell says. "We want to bring back our staff as soon as possible." 

In the clip played during the 2021 GRAMMY Awards show, Mitchell addressed viewers from the empty audience. "We miss our audience and we can't wait until our doors open up again," he says. "We just can't wait."

Candice Fox, a bartender at Hollywood's Hotel Café, believes there will be an outpouring of activity at her workplace once it's safe again. "I like to believe people are going to want to make up for lost time," she tells GRAMMY.com. "I know that people are itching to perform. People are so excited to experience that exchange of energy again. So, I think it's going to explode."

In line with Erratchu's thoughts on the overall music ecosystem, Fox notes that Katy Perry cut her teeth at the 65-capacity room on Cahuenga Boulevard. "She wasn't the big pop star she is now; she was just a girl with a guitar," she says. "So many artists' careers and the GRAMMYs couldn't exist without small, independent venues like the Hotel Café because you've got to start somewhere." In her clip, Fox ruminates on the regulars she's missed for a year, pouring a Boddingtons and mixing an Old Fashioned to an array of empty stools.

Sister Sparrow and the Dirty Birds

Sister Sparrow and the Dirty Birds at Hotel Café in 2015. Photo: Christopher Polk/Getty Images​   

At the end of every venue vignette, each venue representative announced the winner of their assigned categories: Best Country Album for Gray (Miranda Lambert's Wildcard), Best Pop Solo Performance for Erratchu (Harry Styles' "Watermelon Sugar"), Best Rap Song for Billy Mitchell (Beyoncé's and Megan Thee Stallion's "Savage Remix") and Album Of The Year for Fox (Taylor Swift's folklore). All four were thrilled to appear and encourage viewers to support their workplaces—whether by donating directly, paying for a livestream or purchasing a T-shirt. 

That way, the lights at the Station Inn, the Troubadour, the Apollo and Hotel Café can flare up again, ensuring these cultural hubs don't become figments of the past. And if you want to know how memorable the inevitable "COVID is over" parties will be, just look at Gray's blazing smile during the GRAMMYs.

"I can probably count a very [small] number of times that I've seen him truly smile," the Station Inn's Brown reflects. "But truly smiling—that's what he was doing here."

Click here to support the Station Inn.

Click here to support the Troubadour.

Click here to support the Apollo Theater.

Click here to support Hotel Café.

Click here to support NIVA.

Capturing Los Angeles' COVID-Closed Venues